CALL TO ORDER/ ROLLCALL

 PUBLIC COMMENT

 BUSINESS ITEM #1

 ADJOURNMENT
Welcome everyone to the. 00:02:18
City Council regular meeting. I'm calling this meeting to order. The time is now 3:00 PM. 00:02:20
Madam Clerk, can you please take roll? 00:02:26
Council Member Gamma. 00:02:29
Here, Council Member Hernandez. 00:02:32
Here. 00:02:34
You said regular meeting. It's a special meeting. Ohh my bad. It says my apologies. Just want to make sure I'm here at the special 00:02:35
meeting. 00:02:39
Council member Hernandez here, Council Member McQueen, Lesean. 00:02:44
Here. 00:02:49
Mayor Pro Tem Perez here and Mayor Martinez present. 00:02:49
All right. 00:02:58
We will now hear public comments soon. Participants, please use the Raise Your Hand feature if you would like to comment. 00:02:58
You will have 3 minutes to provide comments. 00:03:05
Madam Clerk. 00:03:07
Does anybody in the public have a comment? 00:03:08
There are no public comments. 00:03:11
OK. 00:03:14
Are our business item for today's governance role training session one? 00:03:15
I will now turn it over to our presenter. 00:03:21
Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Appreciate that. 00:03:30
I I'm grateful to be with you today. I'm grateful to see you all today. 00:03:32
And having heard so much about our city attorney through other circles and these. 00:03:37
Good to meet our City attorney face to face for the first time. 00:03:42
So thank you. Thank you for taking the time out of your busy schedules. I I sure do appreciate that. 00:03:45
And I also appreciated. 00:03:50
The opportunity that I had to to meet all of you. 00:03:52
Taking time that day. 00:03:56
And whether here or or via zoom to chat with me. 00:03:58
About the nature of these relationships. 00:04:02
Our city as a whole, it was very evident to me. 00:04:05
After speaking with all of you. 00:04:09
That the one thread that absolutely binds you together. 00:04:11
Is your desire your genuine and sincere desire? 00:04:15
To want the best and to try and achieve the best for the city of Port Wanami. 00:04:19
So I I applaud you for that. I do believe. 00:04:24
With all my heart that um. 00:04:27
You are evidence to me of of the absolutes. 00:04:30
Purest form of democracy because people. 00:04:34
In a representative government. 00:04:38
Like we have. 00:04:40
Often don't have access to our representatives. It's not easy to get to a Congress person. Maybe for some of you it would be or 00:04:41
others who have a local person. 00:04:45
You know, even state assembly, State Senate in California. 00:04:49
Or United States Senators, United States Congress, people hard to really feel like they're representing your interest when they 00:04:53
have so many to represent. 00:04:57
This is different. 00:05:01
If I'm a resident of of Port Winema, I might run into Laura at the council member Hernandez at the grocery store. 00:05:03
Right. I might run into our good mayor at a laundromats or a beach events or something else. 00:05:10
And I'm going to bend your ear a little bit, right? Why can't this happen or that happened and so forth. 00:05:16
And people will complain, in case you didn't know. 00:05:22
Right. So you are truly a pure form of democracy, and I appreciate that. 00:05:26
And and that's kind of where this story begins. We. 00:05:30
We come together. 00:05:33
And we're ordinary citizens. 00:05:35
Sometimes, though, we have extraordinary backgrounds, and in my discussion with you I learned a bit about each of you. 00:05:37
And the story that your life tells. 00:05:43
Your education, your work experience, whatever that is. 00:05:45
And we come together with five talented people. 00:05:49
And the concern that I run into. 00:05:53
Not more often than not, but often enough. 00:05:55
Is that 5? 00:05:58
Really capable and talented people. 00:06:00
Come together. 00:06:04
And can form a rather ordinary governance team. 00:06:05
That is the challenge. 00:06:10
That I run into often, but not more often than not. 00:06:11
And there are situations here on your team where you are, I believe, a better than ordinary citizens. I think with some of your 00:06:15
backgrounds, you're quite extraordinary. 00:06:19
And we need to address some of the things. 00:06:25
That can help us achieve. 00:06:27
That same level. 00:06:29
As a collective. 00:06:31
Right. Often people are driven to be part of something bigger than themselves. I know I've been driven that way, and I don't want 00:06:32
to project my paradigm as if everybody is. 00:06:36
But certainly this is one of those things, the potential. 00:06:41
For this city. 00:06:44
To be the best version of it can, it can be with the five of you leading it, and I do mean the five of you, because you are the 00:06:45
highest level of leadership in this city of Port Wanami. 00:06:50
The potential is immense. It is great. 00:06:57
And you can lead us into the best version of the city of Port Winema that we've ever been. 00:07:00
If not you, then who? 00:07:05
Right. That's the message and and we've put faith in you and when I say we as a reference to the people, right and. 00:07:07
And and this idea of. 00:07:14
We formed this government not to abdicate our responsibility or our ownership. 00:07:16
But because we entrust you with the public trust. 00:07:21
And that's what we're going to start once I get through a couple of admonitions and I'm sure you can see on the screen. 00:07:24
In front of you here I don't want any of you. 00:07:29
To let history. 00:07:32
Rob, you of any hope that we can be any different than what we have been? 00:07:34
You absolutely. 00:07:39
Can be. 00:07:40
More productive? More efficient? More effective. 00:07:42
Than we have been in the past. 00:07:46
You can be equally successful in areas where you've been successful in the past, because I don't want to suggest for a minute. 00:07:47
That you haven't accomplished much because you have. 00:07:53
The civic minded people coming together can always accomplish the will of the people. 00:07:56
When they have their mindset to it and they can remove any artificial obstacles that are placed before them. 00:08:01
But some part of our history here has led to the point. 00:08:07
We're on this, Council. 00:08:10
There has been experience and experience of dysfunction, disharmony, some dissension and some discord. 00:08:12
That does not make you unique. There are many governance teams that experience that and. 00:08:19
Can get past that. 00:08:24
Right. And so I don't want any of our history. 00:08:26
To rob us of any idea. 00:08:29
That we can't be can be a harmonious, effective, productive. 00:08:31
Efficient dischargers. 00:08:35
As a governance team and as individual council members. 00:08:37
That's my personal maxim. Histories to be learned from, not lived in. 00:08:40
And you've all heard the other one the more famous statement about history. Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to 00:08:44
repeat it. 00:08:46
Winston Churchill gets credit for it. Like so many other quotes, even though he was not the first person to say it, he did say it. 00:08:50
But but the reality is we can learn from history, so we don't repeat it. 00:08:57
But we don't have to live in it either. 00:09:01
Let's live in the here forward. 00:09:04
We have a finite amount of energy on any given day. Yours is balanced between. 00:09:06
Your day work, and whatever else you fill your life with. 00:09:10
And then your civic duty that you commit to this great city and its residents. 00:09:13
If we said this bottle. 00:09:17
Represented. 00:09:19
For us a, you know, full complement of liquid energy. 00:09:20
That we get on a daily basis. 00:09:24
And I recall in my meeting with the Council Member Gamma. 00:09:26
He had a lot of energy, you know, he just come in from. 00:09:29
Where he was working and I could feel his energy and my guess is he probably rides his bike to work and all these other things, 00:09:32
no? 00:09:36
So we all have a full complement of energy. 00:09:40
But all of us, no matter how much we have, when we meet that person, that seems to have limitless energy, right? 00:09:44
We still have a finite amount. 00:09:49
Given how much finite amount we have on a daily basis? 00:09:51
Why would we waste any of it? 00:09:54
On things we cannot change. 00:09:57
Like the past. 00:09:59
Let's not do that as a governance. Let's not keep trudging up the past. 00:10:01
Thinking somehow that's going to benefit our future. Instead, let's become what we call energy efficient human beings. 00:10:05
Use our energy here forward, right looking at my watch 308 June 27/20/23 forward. 00:10:13
That's what we do. 00:10:20
If we want to be. 00:10:22
Professionally fulfilled. One of the characteristics of the happiest people I know. There are energy efficient human beings. They 00:10:24
don't waste any of it on the past, not even 5 minutes ago. 00:10:28
With all the talent in this room. 00:10:33
We can't even change 10 minutes ago, let alone. 00:10:35
A year ago, six months ago, whenever that thing happened, right? 00:10:38
So why waste it? Let's not. Let's put ourselves in positions to be successful going forward. And that's what this meeting is 00:10:43
about. 00:10:46
Being energy efficient, human beings leaving the past where it belongs. 00:10:49
And moving forward. 00:10:52
Right. With a set of understanding about how we're going to engage, when we engage, how we engage. 00:10:54
And really, some reminders. 00:10:59
I don't expect that anything I say to a group, this experience like yourselves. 00:11:01
Is going to be revolutionary. 00:11:06
Or remarkable. 00:11:08
But it will help us get on the same page. 00:11:09
And align our unique paradigms. 00:11:12
So don't let history rob you. 00:11:16
Of a different future. 00:11:18
Don't keep looking backwards. 00:11:20
Look forward. 00:11:22
And use our energy where we can so finite amount. The the 2nd admonition I just want to give to you is this one this Tolstoy Very 00:11:23
ironic Tolstoy comment. 00:11:27
Everybody wants to change the world. 00:11:32
But nobody wants to change themselves. What's the irony? Who's the one person we can change? 00:11:34
That's it ourselves. 00:11:41
As I see the mayor pointing to himself, right, that's it. And is that an easy proposition, by the way? 00:11:43
When we hit those reset buttons on January, one last many of us do. 00:11:48
New year, I'm gonna, I'm gonna own this year. 00:11:52
And we set goals. What does the research tell us about the average amount of time that people? 00:11:55
Are able to maintain their commitment to their New Year's resolutions. Any guesses? 00:12:00
Three months. 00:12:06
That's a common guest. 00:12:07
That's a guess. That's a common guess. People think three months. 00:12:09
I think there's a lot of you out there that are three months on those goals, right? The research tells us. 00:12:12
Four days. 00:12:18
So, Madam Mayor Pro Tem, if you're doing it for three months, you're way above average. You really are. I'm pretty average, I 00:12:21
think, when it comes to New Year's resolution. So what's my point? 00:12:25
Imagine. 00:12:31
If everybody. 00:12:33
Working for the best interests. 00:12:35
Of the city of Port Wanami. 00:12:37
Was focused on themselves, starting with this leadership team. 00:12:39
You are just focused on you. 00:12:43
Right. All this introspective analysis going on. 00:12:45
Right. What can I do to be the best governance team member I can be to be the best mayor, best council member, et cetera? 00:12:49
How am I contributing to the success of this thing we're trying to achieve? 00:12:55
How am I? Am I an obstacle? Am I part of the problem or am I part of the solution here? 00:12:59
If everyone of you and then following your example. 00:13:05
Every employee of this city and service provider and everybody else were committed on to, committed to, focusing on themselves. 00:13:08
Myoma, the things we could accomplish if that were the case. 00:13:17
Right. Amazing things would happen. We'd waste. 00:13:21
Zero energy worrying about ohh what my fellow officer is doing right, My fellow patrol officer on my shift. Why does he get to 00:13:23
come in at such and such a time? How come I don't get these many days off? How come they get to you know, let's just focus on us, 00:13:28
what we have control over. 00:13:33
How we do our job, how we discharge our duties and responsibilities, et cetera. 00:13:39
Sometimes we come to a session like this. We might think ohh. 00:13:43
This is not quite what I expected. 00:13:46
I'm sure glad that Council member so and so is here, because they need to hear this. 00:13:48
With in fact, what we really need to be focused on is. 00:13:53
How am I gonna be part of the best practices we're talking about here? 00:13:56
How am I going to be part of the solutions? 00:13:59
If each one of the five of you is focused on that. 00:14:01
Then we will accomplish much this afternoon, we really will. So I appreciate the opportunity to share that with you. I do feel a 00:14:05
little bit like I'm preaching to the choir on some of this stuff. 00:14:09
But I want to give us those reminders so we all start on the same page. One other thing before we jump into the first things I 00:14:15
want to talk about. 00:14:18
In the work that I do when I'm not doing specific work like this with governance teams. 00:14:22
I'm what you call a professional wedge remover. 00:14:27
Right, my clients call me. 00:14:30
And they say, hey Jerry, I got this issue going on in my public works department. Can you come in and figure out what's going on 00:14:31
with the streets crew? 00:14:34
Can you come in and figure out what's going on in my C shift? And my fire department? Got a lot of conflicts on turnover, some 00:14:37
stress claims. 00:14:41
And we come in and figure out what is the source of the conflict, what are the behaviors driving that conflict. 00:14:45
How is it being handled? By leadership, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. And then by the end, we'll know, OK, here's what needs to 00:14:50
stop happening, here's what needs to start happening. 00:14:54
And one of the things that inevitably comes up, I can't think of a project in the last 20 years that I've been doing this. 00:14:58
Where this slide didn't come up and so I share it with you now. 00:15:05
Because I experienced it as I spoke with some of you. 00:15:10
How our tone changes when we're talking about certain other members of the council. 00:15:14
Right, when we're describing what the challenges are. 00:15:19
And who may be the one creating the challenge? 00:15:22
These tones, there's never, ever a justification. 00:15:25
For using these tones, they are 10 adverse impact tones. 00:15:28
And they usually come up in a way. 00:15:34
That if we're on the dice like this and. 00:15:37
You know, we have our our debate going on even though we have these. Wonderful. 00:15:40
You know, policies and procedures for our Council that were amended just about, gosh, not even a year ago. 00:15:46
And it talks about the stability and the professionalism, et cetera, that needs to transpire. 00:15:53
These tones which are neither civil. 00:15:58
Nor respectful. 00:16:00
Right, nor courteous still manifest themselves. 00:16:01
And there's zero justification for it. 00:16:04
I believe that the trust that's been placed in you. 00:16:08
By the members of this residence of this great city and all the other stakeholders who count on you. 00:16:11
Never in their mind thought, yeah, we want our council member who we supported. 00:16:16
To be up there using sarcastic tones. 00:16:20
Right. We want our council member up there to be a negative net or a negative Nelly about everything that's being said. 00:16:23
We want to condescending or its cousin patronizing tone to exit our council members voice right as they share things. So these are 00:16:29
they condescending, patronizing, angry, sarcastic, judgmental. 00:16:35
Frustrated and patient, negative accusatory and intolerance. 00:16:41
And the one I would say that does the most damage. 00:16:45
By way of city harmony. 00:16:48
By way of cultural. 00:16:50
You know, climates, that allows us to be the best version of us as elected, appointed or employees of the city. 00:16:52
Is accusatory. 00:16:58
The accusatory tone that comes out. 00:17:00
People just assume because they think it that it's universally true. 00:17:02
You know you're not doing XYZ and therefore you don't get it at A. 00:17:07
Right. It's an accusatory tone. 00:17:11
And there's just no place for it. 00:17:14
In in society like this. 00:17:15
In a governance team like this where I've met you. 00:17:18
And I have sensed from each of you, I'm not perfect. I'm not a perfect measure of things. 00:17:21
But I have felt from each of you. 00:17:25
You're impassioned desire. 00:17:27
To be here for a different civil civic reason, perhaps. 00:17:29
But to be here in service to others, we just don't ever need to use these adverse impact tones. Any question about that? 00:17:32
Before I press forward with. 00:17:40
Other matters. 00:17:43
I'm not saying you always have to have a Mr. Roger Stone either, right? 00:17:46
When somebody upsets you or uses an accusatory tone at you. 00:17:50
But I also say that you don't have to mirror that tone back. 00:17:54
Somewhere between data input. 00:17:57
And to your personal paradigm. 00:17:59
Before your data output, which is your reaction or your response. 00:18:01
Is that golden moment for you to decide? 00:18:05
Or for you to follow a commitment you've already made. You can't decide in the moment. 00:18:08
If you decide in the moment you're going to lose the battle, you have to have decided well in advance. 00:18:11
No matter what people say or how they say it to me, remember the public fellow governance team member and employee of the city. 00:18:15
I'm going to maintain my civility and professionalism no matter what anybody else does. 00:18:20
And then in the moment you can reinforce it. 00:18:25
Right. You can reinforce that very thing. 00:18:28
So. 00:18:31
You don't have to be, Mr. Rogers, when somebody's screaming at you, both barrels of judgment pointed at you. 00:18:31
But you absolutely can maintain your stability with a serious tone. I I don't appreciate the way you're speaking to me. I don't 00:18:38
appreciate the tone that you're using and the accusations that you're making. So I'm just going to step away, all right? 00:18:43
There's an OK tone. It's neither friendly nor unfriendly. It's just a serious tone. 00:18:50
But going back at them, we win nothing if we start to fall into these tones. So I shared that with you. There's the road map 00:18:55
talking about the public trust, leaders and leadership, the role of City Council, the council manager, form of government. Couple 00:18:59
reminders. 00:19:03
Things that you know, because I'm just going to rely on. 00:19:07
City of Port Wines Municipal Code. 00:19:10
And then, leading by example, the importance of civility and professionalism, reinforcing a couple of things. 00:19:12
Supporting and policing one another. A lot of that right can be found at the end of this document, but a lot of it comes in the 00:19:18
day-to-day support of one another and how. 00:19:22
You connect. 00:19:27
And how you can remedy things when they go wrong. 00:19:28
Some of the stuff that's going to be talking about conflict prevention. 00:19:32
Conflict resolution. 00:19:36
Positively responding to the conflict. 00:19:38
Will be in our July 25th meeting if I have that date correctly. 00:19:40
July 25th. 00:19:46
I'll confirm that later, and then some pitfalls to avoid at the end. 00:19:48
There will be pitfalls that we talk about and we may have talked in some of our meetings, not all of them. 00:19:52
Where we talk about hey. 00:19:57
When I'm out in the world. 00:19:59
I'm a council member. I'm the mayor, the mayor Pro Tem. 00:20:00
But I'm speaking as an individual, you know, isn't that OK? Don't I have the ability to do that? We'll cover some of those in the 00:20:04
pitfalls to make sure that we're not doing things in a way that could undermine the collective efforts of this great governance 00:20:10
team. So with that in mind, let's start with my favorite bits of the Brown Act. It's just one slide. This is all we're going to 00:20:15
cover in the Brown Act right here. Is this because it's almost poetic in nature? It's in the preamble. 00:20:21
Public commissions, boards, councils and other legislative bodies of local government agencies exist to aid in the conduct of the 00:20:27
people's business. 00:20:32
Don't you love that purpose? 00:20:38
That's you. 00:20:40
You exist to aid in the conduct of the people's business. 00:20:42
That people do not yield their sovereignty to the bodies that serve them. 00:20:47
The people insist on remaining informed. 00:20:51
To retain control over the legislative bodies they have created. 00:20:53
So they have entrusted you. They said, hey, this person today I'm going to vote for council member Stephen Gamma. 00:20:58
Right, the incumbent, because I believe he will help aid in the conduct of the people's business. Today I'm going to vote for 00:21:05
Council member, Mayor Pro Tem Misty Perez because I believe she will help us achieve what's best for the city. 00:21:11
They do that and they did that and here you are. 00:21:17
And that trust is well placed. 00:21:21
So long as we discharge. 00:21:23
The duties and responsibilities in a way that either builds. 00:21:25
Maintains. 00:21:29
At the very least, doesn't erode the public trust. 00:21:30
Right. And there are different ways that that can happen. 00:21:35
So. 00:21:37
The people's business. That's what you're here for. 00:21:38
And there's a number of questions we can ask to that end right to to be successful at it. 00:21:41
And when you take your ethics training every couple years, these are four pillars that I believe. 00:21:45
Summarize that whole 2 hour ethics training that we do first one when you're making a decision, am I acting in the best interest 00:21:51
of the public? 00:21:54
If that is one of the four pillars that drives your decision making, along with all the best information provided by this 00:21:59
incredible. 00:22:02
City staff that work around us here and those staff reports. 00:22:06
That is a great pillar that will keep you safe. You don't have to be experts in the law. 00:22:09
And know everything about. 00:22:13
Government Code section 1090. 00:22:15
Or Penal Code section 68 on. 00:22:17
Bribery and other such things. You don't have to know all that. 00:22:20
Is this in the best interest of the public? 00:22:24
Right. And is this. 00:22:26
Well prepared, compliant with the Brown Act, so that we can act upon it. 00:22:28
And then we move forward a second pillar that should help us. 00:22:32
Anything that looks like self interested dealing we need to avoid. 00:22:35
Anything that looks like it's going to benefit us, we need to avoid. 00:22:39
This is all about maintaining building. 00:22:42
At the very least, not eroding that public trust. 00:22:44
And there are in those trainings and. 00:22:47
With our. 00:22:50
Well heeled, great experience law firm that we have as a City Attorney's office. 00:22:51
An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. 00:22:57
And we need to really address things, vet things, and filter things. 00:23:01
Through our cities City Attorney's office, if there's even a question. 00:23:05
Of self interested conduct, self interested dealing. 00:23:08
So that we make sure that we are clearing there and that's our clearing house. 00:23:11
They are the ones who can help us. 00:23:15
If we come to them after the fact, that can be problematic. So anything by way of self-interest in dealing we should avoid. 00:23:17
Right. That's a second great pillar, third out of the four. 00:23:24
Don't abuse a position or authority. 00:23:27
And sometimes it doesn't feel like we're abusing position or authority. 00:23:29
And the rest of the public perceives it as abusing position or authority, little things. 00:23:32
Right like this. Pick an employee, not a governance team member. 00:23:38
Who shows up at A? 00:23:41
You know a formal grand opening event at a local Java Hut somewhere. 00:23:43
And. 00:23:47
You know the person who's the managers from the community. They've known each other all their lives. 00:23:48
And the person says to our our. 00:23:52
Building code compliance officer, right and whatnot. 00:23:54
Hey, well, looks like you're here. I should have expected it. You always wanna free anything? Like a free cup of coffee. Just 00:23:58
joking, Busting chops kind of thing. 00:24:02
And the employee doesn't take it that way. 00:24:05
Well, you're just lucky. I have a sense of humor, so I don't notice all the violations you have in this corridor with these boxes. 00:24:07
Blocking the fire exits. 00:24:13
May not seem like much, but it could be the appearance of abusing position or authority to other folks right to that end. 00:24:15
We have to be careful with the things we say. 00:24:23
Right, even as private citizens, right? Even as. 00:24:26
Non elected individuals with First Amendment rights. 00:24:30
We always have to be careful and and the public is counting on you for that. So act in the best interest of the public, avoid 00:24:34
self-interest to dealing, don't abuse your authority or even have that vision of it. 00:24:39
And then avoid even the appearance of impropriety the good news for you. 00:24:45
You know all this. 00:24:49
You have it already. I've gone through these 34 pages. 00:24:50
Of our policies and procedures for the Council. 00:24:54
Again amended last September and formally I think with our city clerk signature sometime in November. 00:24:57
Of last year. 00:25:03
I share with you the appearance of impropriety can help you in so many ways. 00:25:05
Years ago, when I was still in the trenches as a trial lawyer. 00:25:10
Myself and another. 00:25:13
Umm. 00:25:15
Partner at the firm. I was an associate at the time. 00:25:16
Where I'm responsible for taking anything that was born to trial to go to trial. Not everybody wants to. In most cases, don't. 00:25:19
Umm. 00:25:25
You know, upwards of 98%, somewhere in there. That number fluctuates. 00:25:26
Don't go to trial. They settle, get dismissed, whatever. 00:25:30
Well, we had to take them when they did and we enjoyed it, so. 00:25:33
And one was handed off to me where I had to represent a law firm. 00:25:36
That was being sued for malpractice. It was an insurance claim. It was a matter of expertise, but I could handle that. 00:25:39
And I went there and now one of the partners at the firm. 00:25:44
And by the way, they were just being sued because they were trying to collect 800,000 that a client owed them after a verdict, not 00:25:48
in their favor. 00:25:51
And so they didn't want to pay, and they thought they could get leveraged by. 00:25:55
By suing for malpractice, a common thing that happens. 00:25:58
So there was no actual evidence of malpractice by the firm that was supportable and in the middle of this binding arbitration. 00:26:01
Pursuant to their fee agreement, they settled. 00:26:07
And for almost the full price that the law firm was trying to collect, one of the partners had now become the presiding judge. 00:26:11
That's the Superior Court for their county. 00:26:15
And we went to lunch where 5 counties away. 00:26:19
From where they were. 00:26:21
The presiding judge. 00:26:23
And as I bought dinner. 00:26:25
And this icon in downtown San Jose called Original Joe's. 00:26:27
I was getting ready to pay the bill and she pulls out her purse and. 00:26:31
Starts to give me someone. I said no, no, no. I'll call her Lisa. No, Lisa, it's OK. I'm. I'm gonna cover it. You know, that's my 00:26:35
responsibility. 00:26:37
She says no, no, I have to pay for my own. 00:26:40
And I said we are five counties away. No one's gonna know I bought your lasagna. 00:26:43
And some cheesecake. 00:26:47
And and I felt I was a pretty moral guy saying all those things. 00:26:49
Sealing forward, you know where this is going, right? Sealing forward. And she said Jerry. 00:26:53
I don't know. 00:26:58
And boy, I felt that. 00:27:01
Chastisements, right. Professional chastisement, right there. What's that measure of character we hear so often? 00:27:02
If you have the chance to get away with somebody, no one's ever gonna find out. 00:27:09
But you do the right thing anyway, but you comply anyway. 00:27:13
That's the measure of real character. And this was I was sitting in front of her. 00:27:16
The measure of real character. She taught me a lesson that day. 00:27:20
In 19. 00:27:22
9899 That all these years later I still hold dear to the heart. 00:27:24
Because of the. 00:27:29
It cut me to the course what it did. 00:27:31
O even avoid The appearance of impropriety goes beyond that. 00:27:33
You know and and we'll talk about that a little bit more at some point given our our time. 00:27:37
But those are it if you're focused on these four pillars driving what you do and your formal capacity and those chairs. 00:27:42
Great things will happen. 00:27:48
As well as the civility and the professionalism. 00:27:50
With which you conduct yourselves individually and collectively. 00:27:53
Right, so. 00:27:58
It all boils down to this. 00:27:59
Are you truly committed to being a leader? 00:28:02
Business schools across this great nation, dare I say, across the globe. 00:28:09
Have tried in vain. 00:28:14
With the research that they're doing still today. 00:28:15
To create a universally accepted definition of what a leader is. 00:28:18
And to date one has not been created. 00:28:22
That's academically supported. 00:28:25
You know, we have a military version of leadership. 00:28:27
That gets employed. It's often top down. It's often autocratic and authoritative. 00:28:30
But even that requires more soft power than it used to, given today's military. 00:28:35
Right, there's no one way that works best. 00:28:39
There's democratic leadership. 00:28:42
Servant Leadership. 00:28:44
The list goes on of the types of leadership, affiliative leadership. 00:28:46
Et cetera. 00:28:50
And there is no single best way. 00:28:51
That we can count on, so we're not asking anyone of the five of you. 00:28:54
To align your individual paradigm with one way to lead. 00:28:57
Because that would be a mistake. 00:29:01
The people didn't vote for that. 00:29:02
But they voted for. 00:29:04
Or whatever your leadership style is. 00:29:06
We want you to be courteous, professional and civil. 00:29:08
We want you to get things done. 00:29:11
Right. We want you to get it done. 00:29:14
And that will be their measure of success for so many in positions of authority. 00:29:16
Peter Drucker uses this definition right. The only definition of a leader is someone who has followers. 00:29:20
And it's pretty simple. 00:29:25
But it's real. 00:29:27
And by this definition, all of you. 00:29:28
All of you are defined as leaders. I want to be clear about that. 00:29:31
You have people who follow you don't know if they follow you on Facebook, social media or anything else. 00:29:34
But you're here because you have followers, people who like your version. 00:29:39
Of what we want to do, and we'll follow you because of it. 00:29:43
Umm. 00:29:47
Different experiences you bring to the table. I like Mother Teresa's an awful lot. Your true character is most accurately 00:29:48
measured. 00:29:51
By how you treat those who can do nothing for you. 00:29:54
I love that. 00:29:59
Right. How do you treat people who can do nothing for you? 00:30:00
Well, I'm. 00:30:03
I have I venture to guess that we could probably fill this room. 00:30:05
With people who could give us examples of your goodness. 00:30:08
And the things you do for them. 00:30:11
Even though. 00:30:13
You may not gain anything from them, right? You someone say a vote, but there's other places to get those votes. 00:30:14
Can you do things for a neighbor? An elderly neighbor? 00:30:19
I I have this dream that I'm not gonna travel as much. 00:30:23
One day. 00:30:26
As I do now, every Monday and every Friday I'm on an airplane. 00:30:27
And then work Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday and that dream will include then. 00:30:31
Me being able to take a Thursday night or a Friday night at 3:00. 00:30:34
Of my local senior homes, skilled nursing facilities and other places. 00:30:38
To take my very musical family and entertain them. 00:30:43
Even though they can have nothing that they can give us or do for us, but I do feel like just their their warmth and their 00:30:46
reaction is giving me something. 00:30:50
I believe in this very much. And then Sam Walton. 00:30:55
Leaders must always put their people before themselves. If you do that, your business will take care of itself. 00:30:58
And in your case. 00:31:04
Your people are the people. 00:31:05
The people. 00:31:08
Right. You're about their business. 00:31:09
And if you put them first, I believe this one makes sense for us. 00:31:11
As a governance team in a public entity. 00:31:15
And so that's why I appreciate this one and why it makes sense to use a retail. 00:31:17
You know, giants not not everybody loves. 00:31:22
Because it makes so much sense in the context of. 00:31:25
Public service truly now, while there is no definition, universal definition. 00:31:28
Of what a leader is. 00:31:32
There is a universal definition of leadership. 00:31:34
There is. 00:31:38
Now I can't say because I haven't worked on every continent I've worked in the Western Hemisphere. 00:31:39
Right. I've worked in Mexico and Central America, done a little bit of consulting. 00:31:44
In South America. 00:31:48
Mostly remote stuff that we do in that regard. 00:31:51
And I will tell you. 00:31:54
That this definition crosses international boundaries, but I can't speak for the continent of Africa or. 00:31:55
Or Asia, South, Asia, et cetera. 00:32:01
But you tell me if it resonates with you. 00:32:04
The ability to provide a common or shared objective. 00:32:06
And then motivating a group to achieve that objective. 00:32:09
That is absolutely a universal definition of leadership in the world that I travel in. 00:32:14
The ability to provide a commoner shared objective than motivating a group to achieve that objective. 00:32:19
And you can do it in any context. 00:32:24
And you don't need a title to engage in leadership. 00:32:26
A kid walking down the street here. 00:32:30
Could see something like a huge branch fall off because of a windstorm. 00:32:32
See a couple of grown-ups, a couple of adults and a couple of kids. 00:32:36
And say, hey Sir, can you stop that traffic from coming? Then me and these other kids will take that branch and move it. 00:32:39
So that this won't be a hindrance to the rest of these people. That's leadership. 00:32:44
The ability to provide a common or shared objective, then motivating a group to achieve that objective. 00:32:48
That is what the people expect of you. 00:32:53
As a governance team. 00:32:56
To provide this commoner shared objective. So if someone came up to you today. 00:32:58
And, said council member Gamma, This is rhetorical, don't answer. 00:33:02
What are our objectives in the city? What are we trying to accomplish in the next 18 months? 00:33:06
Council Member Hernandez, What? Our three-year goals, our five year goals. 00:33:12
What foundation are we laying for Port Wanami 20 years from now? 00:33:16
In 2043. 00:33:20
Can we answer those questions? 00:33:22
What are the common or shared objectives? 00:33:24
You may be able to, you may not. I don't know. I don't have enough information to that effect. 00:33:26
I do know that as part of these trainings that were. 00:33:30
You know brought to you by the joint powers authority you belong to. 00:33:33
California JPA. 00:33:37
Terrific pool, by the way. 00:33:39
No connection to him. 00:33:41
Beyond being a service provider for them, but I will tell you. 00:33:43
For many years I owned a firm. 00:33:46
That ran 14 JPH. 00:33:48
We were not public entity employees, We were private staff contracted to run these 14 Jpas. 00:33:51
All over the state of California. 00:33:55
And I compare our teams, which were great. 00:33:57
To the team at at CJPIA. 00:34:00
And equally great, they have a great, great team there and a great resource to all of you to that end. 00:34:03
So. 00:34:09
Are we doing this? Where are we one of the sessions to get back to Cal JPA? 00:34:10
Is they want to support here? 00:34:14
Is to provide and it's not something that we'll do, but somebody else. 00:34:16
A strategic planning facilitator for you? 00:34:20
So that you can update right? Even if you have goals? 00:34:23
Make sure we get those up to date and do that. I don't know how long it's been. I don't know if any of these anyone on this 00:34:26
council has been involved in a strategic planning session. 00:34:30
Or if this team as a whole has, so that'll be something that's important to be able to answer these questions. 00:34:34
And so. 00:34:39
This city needs your collective leadership. 00:34:41
We we love you individually. We need you collectively more than ever. 00:34:44
And so let's just delve right into that then, this council manager form of government. 00:34:48
Relying on. 00:34:53
First, your role, right? What is your role? 00:34:54
When we look at this, that's what this next slide is all about. 00:34:57
Four parts. 00:35:00
Easy to remember. 00:35:02
You could probably share them with me, but let's start with the first one. 00:35:03
You set the direction. 00:35:07
You provide the vision. 00:35:08
For this great city. 00:35:10
What are we about? 00:35:12
If we are here to aid in the people's business. 00:35:14
What do we believe needs to happen? 00:35:18
Over the short term, the midterm, and the long term. 00:35:20
To support the people's business. 00:35:23
It may be involved, but please, Council Member again, can I request that a light up here be turned on? 00:35:29
Or. 00:35:35
Maybe a little more light? 00:35:36
Is that good or you want? Yeah. 00:35:37
Yeah. 00:35:40
Thank you. Thank you for that request. We want you all to be comfortable and be able to see everything. 00:35:41
I just requested the darker because I look better in soft lighting so. 00:35:45
So the vision, right? For some of you, that vision may be. 00:35:50
That we want facilities. 00:35:54
In the jurisdiction. 00:35:56
Of the city of Port Winema to be available to its residents. 00:35:57
Parks, beaches, whatever that is. Courts. 00:36:01
Umm. 00:36:05
Common areas for picnics and gatherings. 00:36:05
That may be a vision for what you have, and collectively you need to decide where that is on the priority. 00:36:08
Versus. 00:36:15
Infrastructure, things like what does, what do our water pipes look like that are primary providers? 00:36:16
Of our clean drinking water. 00:36:23
Right. Are we gonna start to sever some infrastructure that we know some of our larger cities to the South? 00:36:26
Have impacted them over the years, this last 10 years in particular. 00:36:31
And and created them. 00:36:35
Tremendous deficits that may not, may or may not have been planned for, depending on who you ask. 00:36:38
And all were a part of deferred maintenance. 00:36:42
Right, Because we thought we had time. 00:36:45
When these? 00:36:47
Clay, ceramic, and other such material water pipes were put in in 1908, or whenever that was. 00:36:48
So what are those goals that will give us the opportunity to say, OK, our vision is? 00:36:55
A safe. 00:36:59
Well heeled infrastructure for the city. 00:37:01
A data and then we break it down to other goals and then the city manager. 00:37:04
Takes those goals and we have a new city manager starting, so it's a great time to have this dialogue. 00:37:08
Takes those goals and ensures they understand them and you ensure they understand them. 00:37:13
And then they. 00:37:18
Delegate them to the different directors in the city. They get delegated down to managers without your vision. 00:37:20
The goals that our departments are setting. 00:37:26
Are just to the best of their ability. 00:37:30
To. 00:37:32
Deal with the day-to-day operational things of the City of Port Wanami. 00:37:33
And they're not, perhaps. 00:37:36
And I don't know them, so this isn't in any way a judgment of them. But in cities like this, where there's no overarching vision. 00:37:38
They create goals, these directors. 00:37:44
That they think. 00:37:46
Are the best. 00:37:47
For the department, for the city, et cetera. 00:37:49
And they may or may not be connected to one another. 00:37:51
We need this to be a cohesive collective, trying to move the collective needle for this city to achieve outcomes. 00:37:54
That you? 00:38:00
Envision. 00:38:02
Right. And it can only be done once we have that vision in place. So number one, set direction for the city. 00:38:03
#2 You adopt the policies and procedures that are needed. 00:38:09
To successfully. 00:38:13
Operate this city on a regular basis. 00:38:15
Right. What are the policies and procedures that set behavioral expectations? 00:38:18
That creates structure. 00:38:22
Because structure drives behavior. 00:38:23
Where there's no structure, some employees will not thrive. 00:38:26
And others might be paying on their own personal character, et cetera. But structure drives behavior. 00:38:30
And we set that structure through a number of policies that we create so. 00:38:35
Vision. 00:38:39
Policies and procedures. 00:38:39
And then you are. 00:38:41
Advocates. 00:38:43
To the world. 00:38:44
Right. So this world that we call Port Wanami. 00:38:45
And you share those with the people you encounter in your various roles and capacities. 00:38:47
At both official and unofficial. 00:38:52
Engagements that you're out there. 00:38:55
Attending. 00:38:57
Representing the city. 00:38:58
You share with people? Yeah. Here's what we're doing, here's what we're focused on. When you go to regional things and you meet 00:38:59
with other council members from other cities. 00:39:03
In the county or beyond? 00:39:06
Right. You talk and you listen to them and what will you impart? The things that you're all about? 00:39:08
And what we're trying to achieve here in the city and how and why, etc. 00:39:13
So you're the great champions? 00:39:16
Every goal needs champions. 00:39:19
And you were the great champions of those goals to folks that will listen. 00:39:21
And and those folks are typically members of the community and other stakeholders, typically not the employees themselves, but 00:39:25
everybody else. Yes, those goals should be shared through their leadership chain. 00:39:30
From city manager to director to Manager, supervisor, then the employees themselves and lastly. 00:39:35
And this is your role right on this leadership that we need you hire a city manager. 00:39:42
That is one of your primary objectives, those four. 00:39:47
Pillar things that you need to do, attract and retain. 00:39:51
And and performance manage a city manager. 00:39:54
Well, here we are, right. You've just done that and we do that periodically. 00:39:57
And so we've hired a city manager who we believe possesses through our vetting process. 00:40:02
We believe possesses the skills. 00:40:07
Abilities, experience and know how. 00:40:09
They are a subject matter expert in the governance. 00:40:13
Of local governments, municipalities in particular. And now that you have them, your job is to ensure that they are doing the 00:40:16
things. 00:40:19
That they said they were gonna do and that you want them to do. 00:40:23
Because that's the one employee you do get to supervise and manage. 00:40:27
Is the city manager any questions about those four areas of vision policies? 00:40:30
Communication, right? Being the Champions or the hiring of a city manager? 00:40:36
Please, I think the choice of. 00:40:42
Avoiding here, it's interesting that you use the word shepherd. 00:40:45
That the city manager should shepherd the council's vision. Can you elaborate on what you mean by shepherd? 00:40:49
Yeah, you know. 00:40:56
It is a form of leadership and may be evidence of one that I like. 00:40:58
You can only be a shepherd leader if you have competent people around you. 00:41:02
Right. And what does the shepherd do? A shepherd sometime walks behind. 00:41:06
And when I think of a sheep shepherd, right, and and one of the sheep starts to wander off, you know, and wander off. 00:41:09
They get them back in, they jump in and bring them back into the fold, if you will, that kind of thing. Some shepherds are in 00:41:16
front. 00:41:19
In March. 00:41:23
This is still true in March. 00:41:24
I had an occasion to to visit the Middle East. 00:41:27
And I was in Israel. 00:41:30
And in Turkey? 00:41:31
And while I was there. 00:41:33
We we went with this. 00:41:35
Individual who we had hired and took us out because I wanted to see the Shepherd leadership at work. 00:41:37
And sure enough, they had corralled. 00:41:41
Couldn't be less than 500 sheep into the safeguard. 00:41:45
Natural demographics around. 00:41:48
And then a gates made out of wood. 00:41:50
Like an Old West kind of gate, you know what I mean? Just raw, raw fencing. 00:41:54
And that's for protection. And the shepherds align themselves around the outside at night. Some they had one or two dogs, but 00:41:57
mostly it was human work. 00:42:00
And in the morning they opened the gate. 00:42:04
And once Shepherd calls. 00:42:07
And his sheep. 00:42:08
Know his voice, and they follow him. 00:42:10
And then the next shepherd and the next. And it's amazing how that unfolds. Some shepherds I noticed are out front. 00:42:13
Summer up and back and they're doing this right, bringing them back into the safety of of the. 00:42:18
Flock. 00:42:24
And so for me, a city manager. 00:42:26
If he or she is fortunate enough to have a capable workforce. 00:42:28
Working, for example, in the city of Port Wanami. 00:42:32
All he or she has to do. 00:42:35
Is give that vision. 00:42:37
Taken from you to those directors. 00:42:38
And ensure that those directors. 00:42:41
Are communicating. 00:42:43
And managing. 00:42:45
The outcomes of their responsibility to achieve the vision that you have set. 00:42:47
And they ship her debt by. 00:42:53
Pretty much leaving them alone until they need to go there and speak. 00:42:54
And do or take action. 00:42:59
And if you have a director, who for example? 00:43:00
Is more of a placeholder than a leader. 00:43:03
They're in their final years of those peers, handcuffs. 00:43:05
And. 00:43:08
They're not really doing much. Let's just say an example. Of course I'm thinking of an entirely other city than this one. 00:43:09
And. 00:43:15
Then the city manager has to get in to say, hey, this is not OK, you need to do more. These are the things that you were lacking 00:43:16
with specifics, right? 00:43:19
And I need to see this from you. Let's check in and. 00:43:23
30 days and see where you're at with this. 00:43:26
To me that is the shepherding part when the performance isn't happening. 00:43:28
They are guiding that performance. 00:43:32
They are leading that performance and they're holding it accountable. 00:43:34
And the accountability can be absolutely positive, as positive as it can be, but it has to has consequences. 00:43:37
Has to have consequences. 00:43:42
In order for it to be effective because structure drives behavior. 00:43:45
Systems thinking. That's how it works, right? 00:43:49
So that's what I mean by shepherding that they they need to be constantly vigilant. 00:43:51
Because they have to report back to you. 00:43:55
Right. And if there's elements to it and our mayor has a question, Council Member Gamma has a question, why haven't we achieved 00:43:58
this or why haven't we achieved that? 00:44:02
And the answers need to be readily available. 00:44:07
Lack of resources? Ohh well we had the tornado that came through. 00:44:10
And it set us back, you know, three months. 00:44:14
There have to be answers to those questions. 00:44:17
And if they're not, then you know you have to ask why don't we have answers? 00:44:20
Does our leader not have their finger on the pulse of what's happening? 00:44:24
Right. And then we could also ask as we police each other. 00:44:27
Well, Mr. Mayor, I appreciate your question, but as I'm listening to the. 00:44:31
City manager. 00:44:35
It seems like that information would not be available to anybody, so I'm not sure how reasonable the request is. 00:44:36
And you? 00:44:41
Police each other on the idea of whether or not we're making unreasonable demands on our leaders. 00:44:42
Right. So that's an important part of this, of what you do. So that was my long answer. Thank you, Council member to that 00:44:47
question. 00:44:51
Any other comments or questions? I don't want to be questions, they can be comments. 00:44:54
Are you comfortable with this some? 00:44:58
If you disagree with any of its. 00:45:00
Is it consistent with what you learned when you went to the League of California Cities? 00:45:02
Right. And they're training. 00:45:07
It's better. 00:45:09
That's better than what? 00:45:10
We got it. The league, I think. Good, good, good, good. All right. See. Nothing. Let's continue to press on. 00:45:12
And and I will take a break by the way, right at the one hour mark what what is, what was our agenda on how much time we allowed 00:45:16
it for this meeting? 00:45:19
2:00 o'clock two hours, right? 00:45:23
Alright, so I'll take a break right into one hour, right? 00:45:25
So right at 4:00 o'clock. 00:45:29
I will take a break. 00:45:30
So. 00:45:32
When you give that direction. 00:45:34
Please remember, stay in your lane, right, in a positive way, council member comma. You have a different number. 00:45:35
Is it 4:30 or? 00:45:42
No, that's for the next meeting. 00:45:44
So. 00:45:49
Well, I going till five, right? Yeah, we'll go till 5. 00:45:50
OK. 00:45:52
OK. 00:45:53
For the next meeting. 00:45:57
Very good. 00:45:58
A little more likely. 00:46:02
Maybe, Anna, it's maybe the. 00:46:04
That's. 00:46:08
Yeah, that's nice. I can see you all even better now. 00:46:09
So since we know those are our roles and and truly. 00:46:13
You know when, when we elected you right, We the people. 00:46:16
That's our expectation of you. 00:46:20
Some people may have other expectations of you. 00:46:22
They may say right as they come to you, hey, I voted for you, I campaigned for you. My whole neighborhood got you a majority of 00:46:26
the voters, You know, because what we did. 00:46:30
So what are you going to do about this tree? 00:46:35
Right. 00:46:38
And they may come to you with those questions. 00:46:39
And I think those are fair requests as far as in their mind goes or their collective paradigm. 00:46:41
But if it doesn't fit. 00:46:46
Within what we just described. 00:46:49
Of setting a vision. 00:46:51
Right setting, adopting policies and procedures. 00:46:53
Being champions and communicating what these things are. 00:46:56
And then working through our city manager who we hired will hopefully will retain and will be great for us. 00:46:59
Then we don't do it. We say, hey, I appreciate what you're saying. 00:47:04
I can see why that would be a concern to you. 00:47:07
I will talk to our city manager and let him know. 00:47:09
About this concern. 00:47:12
And. 00:47:14
Hopefully that will go through the process and they'll let you know what can or can't be done. 00:47:15
That's it. That's what we do, right? To stay in our lane, if you will. Why? Because there's immunities that we're talking about 00:47:19
here. When you stay in your lane, there are protections. 00:47:23
And and if you want great detail on those, just talk to your city attorneys office and and have them talk to you. 00:47:29
About those things further, what we'll cover is just a little bit here on those immunities in a little bit as well. 00:47:35
But those four areas have to be our driving force. 00:47:41
As we now pivot over to. 00:47:44
What our council manager role looks like and what we do so relying on the great municipal code of Port Wanami, not going to spend 00:47:46
a lot of time. 00:47:49
I'm just going to summarize some of these and and not read them, but a couple I will read. 00:47:53
So you created the office of City Manager, if not you, then your predecessors with this municipal code that we have. 00:47:58
And and one of the things that I read that I liked, I don't see it in everyone. There's a lot of, you know. 00:48:03
There's a model, sort of municipal code out in the world that a lot of people rely on. 00:48:08
In California, and I will tell you that not all of them say. 00:48:13
Appointed by the Council solely on the basis of merits. 00:48:17
I like that. 00:48:21
I like that statement because I've always felt. 00:48:22
I just want to be the master of my own destiny. 00:48:25
And I don't want any artificial obstacles there, and I don't want any nepotism or favoritism getting in the way either. 00:48:27
And so solely on the basis of merit, I like that very much. 00:48:33
This one tells us. 00:48:36
That the city manager is the leader of the administration of the day-to-day operation of the city. 00:48:38
As it says on the last, second, last line, efficient administration of all. 00:48:46
Of city affairs under his control. 00:48:50
Right, and here's how he does it. Or she does it, depending on who our city manager is. 00:48:52
The top ones just telling us. 00:48:57
They prepare a budget. 00:48:59
And they monitor the budget and they report to you on the budget. 00:49:00
You can expect that of your city manager based on your code. 00:49:03
They keep you fully apprised to the financial conditions of the city. 00:49:06
Big part of it. 00:49:10
Your municipal code that you develop says, yeah, we're gonna do that. 00:49:11
And by the way, we want you to prepare periodic financial reports for us and that office does that, the office of City manager. 00:49:15
On this one. 00:49:21
It's talking to us a lot about. 00:49:22
Umm. 00:49:24
There are procedures and policies at times that need to be developed in order to administer the business of the city. No better 00:49:25
example of that than 2020-2021. 00:49:31
And 2022 with our worldwide pandemic. 00:49:36
So many of my client cities. 00:49:40
Umm. 00:49:43
Had to develop hybrid work policies right or full remote work policies. 00:49:44
And some of them work so well. 00:49:50
One of my public agencies. 00:49:52
Still has. 00:49:54
A remote policy where people only come to the organization. 00:49:56
Once, Maybe twice a week, tops. 00:50:00
And they're still all working remotely because they've been so productive. Now they're not a city. It would be different if you're 00:50:02
a city. How do you do public works remotely, right? How do you do public safety remotely? 00:50:07
There are regional agency that serves all nine counties of the Bay Area. 00:50:11
And so there's they're able to do it and they're doing a great job with it. So they the manager does that, our city manager who we 00:50:16
hire retain. 00:50:19
Formulates policies and rules and regulations, etcetera. They're going to attend council meetings. 00:50:23
Right. They attend council meetings. 00:50:28
And when I said the earlier one about. 00:50:30
Prepare administrative rules and regulations necessary or expedient. 00:50:34
That doesn't mean they can create legislation. 00:50:39
Or policies or procedures, right? That's your job. That was clearly the second pillar for you. 00:50:42
And they do that but exigent circumstances. 00:50:48
They have authority to do certain things. 00:50:50
And they're they're your PR person. 00:50:53
You wanted to be good at that because there are a big part of that. They ensure that. 00:50:55
All the paperwork that needs to be done for people to conduct business in the city within the rules you created for the city. 00:51:01
Are accomplished and if not, there have to be consequences, right? And if changes need to be made because of exigent 00:51:06
circumstances, you expect them. 00:51:09
To be competent and capable to do that. 00:51:13
And then they appoint people. 00:51:16
Hopefully qualified, capable. 00:51:17
Based on their merit, kind of people to do the people's business here in the city. 00:51:19
They dismiss, suspend, remove all those things on there. 00:51:24
Letter H sub Part H. 00:51:28
Employees in the city within. 00:51:31
The bounds of the law. 00:51:33
Right, whatever law applies. 00:51:34
And they sometimes employ temporary part time people as needed. 00:51:36
Going through a couple of these. 00:51:39
They bottom when they devote his or her entire time to the duties of his or her office. 00:51:41
And to the interests of the city. 00:51:45
Or we need that? 00:51:48
In the city manager. 00:51:49
I've never met a city manager who could have one foot on the dock and 1 foot on the boat. 00:51:50
And be really successful at it. 00:51:55
You know they're gonna get wet if they try to do that. 00:51:57
So I think that's an important one. I'm glad you have it in your. 00:52:00
Municipal code describing the duties of that city manager. 00:52:04
And perform other duties as you require of them and within their power. 00:52:07
Procure things that need to be procured within the policies. 00:52:11
That you've adopted and created consistent with those things. 00:52:15
And always keep it in mind, being fiscally sound. 00:52:18
And can. 00:52:21
Having that budget in mind. 00:52:22
Recommend. Here's where it comes back to you. Recommend ordinances and resolutions. 00:52:25
To the Council for adoption. 00:52:29
One of your primary roles. 00:52:31
Right that that the the city manager deems necessary or expedient. 00:52:33
Does that mean you have to adopt those things? 00:52:38
Does the city manager come to you and say, hey, you need to adopt this? 00:52:41
They might, but I don't know how effective they would be and how long they would last if they were dictating to you. 00:52:44
I do know city managers that wield a great deal of power. 00:52:50
And have been around their cities a long time. 00:52:53
And because of their track record of excellence. 00:52:55
They are deferred to quite a bit in that city. 00:52:58
But there's no guarantee, because you. 00:53:01
Are the shepherds the check and balance of the city's business here when it comes to ensuring? 00:53:04
Is this in the best interest of the city? 00:53:08
Right. Is this in the best interest of the people? That's your role? 00:53:11
And so you have to maintain that one, take that one very seriously. 00:53:15
Right. 00:53:18
We want to make sure our city manager also knows that if there's something going on here. 00:53:19
That somehow impeding our ability to effectively discharge the work of the city. 00:53:23
They're on top of it and they report back to us and we say. 00:53:27
Hey, what's this? Hold up. 00:53:30
How come we haven't had any permit signed in? 00:53:31
The last three months, what is the problem? Whatever it is, right, we expect them to be able to answer those questions for us. 00:53:34
With facts and data. 00:53:39
And do those things. 00:53:40
So there's a lot we expect of these city managers exercise general supervision. 00:53:42
Over all of our structures. 00:53:47
And ensure they're properly maintained, right? And a good facilities crew, et cetera. 00:53:48
Capital improvement projects, we expect them to be on top of those as we. 00:53:54
And charge them if one of our pillars one of our visions. 00:53:58
The pillar of creating a vision is, hey, we want to get on in 2324, we want to be right on top of. 00:54:01
The deferred maintenance of our City Hall. 00:54:09
Right Then you expect him? 00:54:12
To formulate a great deal of those capital improvement projects, along with building, planning, community development, whoever 00:54:14
that is, and to shepherd those things through. 00:54:18
And report back to you on a consistent basis, those types of things. 00:54:22
Cooperate with community organizations. 00:54:26
We hope they're never at odds with any stakeholders in Port Wanami. 00:54:28
Umm. 00:54:32
This is always one that I wonder how people feel when I bring that one up. 00:54:32
People haven't written in different ways. Under your subpart S, it says receive an open all mail address to the council. 00:54:37
And give immediate attention thereto. 00:54:43
So that all the administrative business referred to and said communications. 00:54:46
Not necessarily requiring Council manic. Like that word, action may be disposed of between council meetings. 00:54:50
So just a quick question. 00:54:56
Is it our city clerk that opens that mail? 00:54:58
Right. And that's what's necessary for it in filtering that. 00:55:00
Still. 00:55:05
Right. We have to have that responsibility to be maintained and and. 00:55:05
The City manager ensuring that our wonderful City clerk is discharging that duty and responsibility. 00:55:09
So this one's a little bit bigger. I put it on one slide. Neither the council nor any member thereof shall give orders to any 00:55:14
subordinates of the city manager. 00:55:19
That means. 00:55:24
Anybody below below the city manager, whether it's director, manager. 00:55:25
Non supervisory employee. 00:55:29
Patrol officer, Sergeant, you name it. 00:55:31
The city manager shall take instructions from the council. 00:55:34
Only when sitting in a duly held meeting of the Council. 00:55:37
That's your municipal code. 00:55:42
Right. 00:55:44
How are we doing this? Is rhetorical. 00:55:45
Or you can comment if you want but. 00:55:47
It's rhetorical. 00:55:49
Going back to focusing on ourselves. 00:55:50
Am I part of the problem or part of the solution? 00:55:54
City manager shall take instructions from the council only when sitting in a duly held meeting of the council. 00:55:57
Do we? 00:56:03
Expect our city manager when we speak to them. 00:56:04
To take what we say. 00:56:07
As direction. 00:56:09
Right, there's the question. 00:56:12
And the the thing I'd like to point out to you is. 00:56:14
As a member of this governance team, what you may think? 00:56:17
Is regular conversation. 00:56:21
When you pop into the city manager's office. 00:56:24
May feel like more than that to the person on the receiving end. 00:56:27
You may just say, hey, I noticed that they really. 00:56:32
Cut back. 00:56:35
Those crape Myrtle trees more than normal, they look like stumps. 00:56:37
Not like cut back crape myrtles over on Maple Ave. 00:56:41
You know, and it's just shocking to see. I wonder if they've made a mistake. 00:56:44
You're just making an observation. 00:56:49
How might that be heard by a city manager? 00:56:52
I'm going to go talk to Public Works, my director. 00:56:55
And see what that's about. 00:56:57
And so I see created action. 00:56:59
City manager has a lot of action they need to deal with and a lot on their plate. 00:57:01
And the city manager shall take instructions. 00:57:06
From the Council only when sitting in a duly held meeting of the Council. 00:57:08
Because the governance team. 00:57:12
Gives the city manager. 00:57:15
Instruction, action, etc. Not one individual council member. 00:57:16
That is a tough line for most of my. 00:57:21
You know. 00:57:25
Governance team city councils. 00:57:26
To manage, that's a tough line for many on those teams to manage. For context, we have hundreds of public entity clients. 00:57:28
Right, We do. And that's a tough line to manage. 00:57:36
Do you have any questions, concerns, clarification, or anything else that you want on this particular subject? 00:57:38
It was written, but I am in complete agreement. I did just come back. 00:57:52
From a JPI train. OK and so this is. 00:57:57
A lot more in depth. 00:58:02
But point on. 00:58:04
What? What I came back with? 00:58:06
And so I think, I think for us. 00:58:08
What is in my mind right now? 00:58:13
Is um. 00:58:16
As a. 00:58:18
Team which we are governance team. 00:58:19
That I feel that. 00:58:22
I want to believe that, my colleagues. 00:58:24
Are open to holding. 00:58:29
Each of us accountable. 00:58:31
When we. 00:58:33
See things that are outside of our own governance documents specifically. 00:58:35
But just. 00:58:40
The the responsibility. 00:58:42
Of the Council. So I appreciate you making this one comment because even sometimes. 00:58:44
Things come up and I say like ohh, I'm part of the team. I didn't even know about that or. 00:58:52
How are we even talking about this right now? Someone else will say something and I'll say. 00:58:57
Really. 00:59:00
And I'm like, am I supposed to know that too or you know? So I think that we have a lot of work to do as it relates to being a 00:59:01
governance team. 00:59:05
And that at some point we we really have to get into just really holding each other responsible and not being afraid to say things 00:59:09
that might make people uncomfortable. I'm in the same line as you are. I think that you could say pretty much anything you want to 00:59:15
say and you can be professional about it. 00:59:21
And so I would really like to get there, but I would really like to get to the point to where if I'm. 00:59:27
If I'm seeing something that I feel safe that I can call it out. 00:59:32
And that my, the other council members will do the same, I think, because if we don't get there then we'll continue to have the 00:59:37
same issues that we. 00:59:41
We we have. 00:59:45
If we don't get to the point to where we can, we can. We can. And when I say call each other out, I don't mean to be aggressive. I 00:59:46
just mean to speak up and say, ohh, I thought that was outside of our roles and responsibilities or oh, I thought that was the 00:59:52
city manager's role. Absolutely. Things like that. Yeah. And it would look like this just for a moment, I'm going to elevate 00:59:57
myself to a council member. Right, Say. 01:00:03
Ohh. 01:00:08
Council member McQueen Lejohn. Did I say your last? OK, I appreciate what you're saying there. I really do. 01:00:09
I don't know if you noticed, but the way you framed it or when that next meeting could happen. 01:00:17
It would exclude me. 01:00:21
I don't think you intended that right? And so I did. Couldn't help but feel left out of that. Or like my voice maybe didn't matter 01:00:22
as much, but. 01:00:26
Can we pick a different time? 01:00:31
Right. As opposed to me doing it this way. 01:00:33
That was a very obvious microaggression, Martha. 01:00:36
And right. And so there are ways to say things that are professional, that are courteous and are civil. 01:00:39
And. 01:00:46
We want that so bad. 01:00:48
We the people. 01:00:50
As a non elected person, not from Port Wanami, but I'm telling you. 01:00:52
We want that. 01:00:56
We do. 01:00:58
You don't need to be. 01:00:59
A jerk. 01:01:01
To get a point across or to look tough, you just don't. 01:01:03
You don't need to be aggressive or the aggressor to do that to look strong, tough, capable, like you really care about this. 01:01:07
You can do it by virtue of your regular attendance. 01:01:15
Your commitment to your preparation in advance of our Council meetings. 01:01:18
Your commitment to understanding the issues. 01:01:21
And not asking questions that are. 01:01:24
Parents and obvious that you haven't looked at the staff reports. 01:01:27
Right, et cetera. That's how we look like we are truly committed. 01:01:30
To our role as public servants and part of this great governance team of Portland, Amy. 01:01:34
This is the most time I've ever spent. 01:01:39
In the city of Port Wanami. 01:01:42
My meetings with you being the 1st. 01:01:44
And now and then continuing to come back and work with you and having the pleasure and privilege of doing so. 01:01:46
And. 01:01:51
As I drive around your city because. 01:01:52
I don't know. I kind of consider myself sort of a casual subject matter expert as I drive around all my cities that I work with. 01:01:55
There are a lot of things to like about this city. 01:02:04
And there are a lot of things. 01:02:07
You know that I see. And I said Ohh, that's what council member so and so was talking about. Ohh. That's what the mayor mentioned, 01:02:09
right. This is in my one-on-one dialogues with you. 01:02:13
And I see them. 01:02:17
You know and I think. 01:02:19
This city has so much potential. 01:02:21
You won't see it, right? It's already great as it is. I hate the idea of me suggesting like it's a meeting, a significant other. 01:02:24
Hey, I really like you. You've got a lot of potential. I can turn you into something. That's not what I mean, right? That's not 01:02:28
what I mean. What I mean is. 01:02:33
There's no reason this governance team can't be the best governance team in the history of the city of Port Miami. 01:02:39
If we're willing to look inward and say to ourselves. 01:02:45
How can I do this and be a part of this in a way? 01:02:47
That is consistent with the trust the public has. 01:02:50
And provided you with. 01:02:54
And entrusted me with to that end. 01:02:55
So this is a big one, right? 01:02:58
Watch what you say. You know and and I'm not speaking to anyone of you, I'm speaking to all five of you. 01:03:01
Watch what you say when you are meeting with our city manager. 01:03:06
If if you happen because of our city manager's absence or different things going on. 01:03:11
Our assistant city manager or whomever, That would be right. 01:03:15
Watch what you say, how you say it, to whom you're saying it, who's present when it's being said. 01:03:19
Because it may not sound like an action item to you. 01:03:24
But it's being heard as one. 01:03:27
More often than not, yes, Councilman. 01:03:28
So. 01:03:31
Mr. Preciado, can you take the example that you gave us about the City Council member going into the city manager's office and? 01:03:32
Complaining or just noting? 01:03:41
Problems with the tree. What should have happened? What would ideally? 01:03:43
How should have that gone? 01:03:47
Would the city manager have to say, you know you need to bring this up at council and then just the council member come to 01:03:49
council? 01:03:52
And bring it up and then go through an approval process. 01:03:56
Ideally, what would be the? 01:03:59
Optimal way of. 01:04:01
Addressing once? Yeah. Concern. 01:04:03
Yeah, that's a good question and and. 01:04:05
And rely on the city attorney to. 01:04:07
Get me back on track and shepherd me and if I run afoul of this one. 01:04:10
But there is an obligation in these. I meant what I said when I said I did read them. 01:04:15
Read him a couple of Times Now. 01:04:20
That says you know when your mail comes. 01:04:21
Our city manager slash, our city clerk, is going to review that. 01:04:23
And provide you with any information that's needed, otherwise process it the way they would. 01:04:27
And you each. 01:04:31
Have an obligation. 01:04:33
That if you get mail from a member of the public related to a matter of public concern, et cetera. 01:04:34
That you're supposed to give that to to our City Clerk for processing as well. 01:04:40
That's what it says in here, right? 01:04:44
And because it's a matter of public record, it's a matter of. 01:04:47
You know, is it? 01:04:51
Discoverable as the PR a public records act, right? That kind of thing. 01:04:52
So. 01:04:57
Kevin, do you want to chime in on that right as we're talking about public records as well as records retention. I believe the 01:04:58
City of San Jose case made very clear that even records received by council members on their personal cell phones or their 01:05:03
personal e-mail addresses. 01:05:07
So long as they relate to items of city, business need to be preserved and or turned over. 01:05:12
In the event about public records, act request which they are responsive. 01:05:19
In addition, one of the things that's that's off cited in our records retention schedules but not. 01:05:22
Very well talked about as government code section 34090. 01:05:27
Which essentially requires that any record document needs to be retained for a minimum period of two years. 01:05:32
So that would theoretically include. 01:05:39
Text messages. 01:05:42
Emails things of that nature and if a Public Records Act request does come in and those items are not preserved. 01:05:44
There's some potential liability there. 01:05:51
Thank you. That's exactly what I was looking for, Council member Davis. So I was the target of A. 01:05:53
Nasty gram that was sent to. 01:05:59
For my colleagues and not myself. 01:06:01
So what you're saying is, is that? 01:06:04
That should be shared with me. 01:06:06
No, it should be shared and processed through our City Clerk. 01:06:09
And then she would follow whatever process we follow. 01:06:12
In the context of correspondence like that so, but again I want to be clear. 01:06:15
Somebody sends a letter and it says Steven Gomez is the worst person. Yeah, for this assignment. 01:06:19
And and sends it to everyone but me. 01:06:25
Should not be made aware of that. 01:06:28
If it's gonna be discussed in a meeting, is that our policy in the city that when you get a mail, mail like that referring to a 01:06:30
council member who didn't receive it? 01:06:34
Is it our policy that then we make that Council Member aware? 01:06:40
Because we follow whatever our policies say. 01:06:44
I haven't personally received a such a notice or complaint or letter, but normally what I do do is when I get something, all 01:06:48
council is made aware. 01:06:53
It's like what it's provided to one, it's provided to all. 01:06:59
That is typically the answer. Council member, Yeah, well, but I think what he's referring to is it was only sent to council. It 01:07:02
was not sent to anybody else. 01:07:06
And so, going back to what our city attorney said, then council should have provided that to our records keeper. 01:07:09
Our city clerk, who then would have made it available to all who had not, and that would be you should have gone to you. Yeah, 01:07:16
right. And it should be. 01:07:19
Across the board I mean if information and I think that's been a problem that. 01:07:23
We had previously as a sharing of information. 01:07:27
You know, like if I. 01:07:32
Said Hey, a tree just fell over. 01:07:34
That I. 01:07:38
Observed on a 10:00 o'clock at night walk. 01:07:39
And I do the go Gov. 01:07:42
To to. 01:07:45
Make the city aware of it. I don't expect that to be shared with all the other council members. 01:07:46
Is that correct? 01:07:51
What does the Gogov do? Is that part of our website alerts? It's a way to report issues. 01:07:54
Graffiti, like graffiti, is a great example. Here I see it, I take a picture, I send it in. 01:07:59
And we move on. 01:08:05
Yeah, but that's quite different than. 01:08:06
Somebody, yeah, because that's a communication from you, not somebody else, to a council member like you or any of the others. 01:08:09
And if you're sharing that communication, it's not clear that. 01:08:17
What one of you shares? 01:08:20
In your observations about the city needs to go to everybody else. That part's not clear to me. 01:08:22
And I I think it's important here to highlight the implications of the Brown Act where a quorum may not discuss or deliberate or 01:08:26
take action on any item of business within the subject matter jurisdiction of the city, certainly if if an item of. 01:08:34
Public significance gets sent to 1 member of the Council. 01:08:42
Then each of the other members should. 01:08:46
Be free to access it and it should be provided to everyone on the Council equally. 01:08:48
The problem then lies in. 01:08:53
There can't be deliberation. 01:08:55
Not unless it's agendized for a duly organized public meeting where the public has an opportunity to comment as well. 01:08:57
And that's assuming it's within the subject matter jurisdiction of the city. 01:09:03
So when? 01:09:07
So. 01:09:08
So if a letter is sent to four council members. 01:09:09
On a. 01:09:14
Targeted subject manner. 01:09:15
And the other council members not. 01:09:18
Provided that information, and then there's a discussion of it. That letter in a deliberation on the on the dyess. 01:09:20
You know that. 01:09:28
That's. 01:09:29
Unfortunate, I think. I think, but again it. 01:09:30
That shouldn't happen, in fact, what you're saying, Well, not if it's of correspondence the way we just described it, if it if it, 01:09:34
you know, checks these boxes. 01:09:37
Then at some point you should have been provided with that information. Matter of public interest from members of the public to 01:09:42
the. 01:09:45
Other council members, you know that information needs to be shared and we don't always remember that one. Why it's good to have 01:09:49
meetings like these. 01:09:52
To remember that when that letter comes, whether it's about, hey, we have this barking dog issue in my trailer park on the east 01:09:55
side of town. 01:09:58
You know, stuff like that, we turn it over and then it gets disseminated as appropriate. So she had her hand up first and then 01:10:02
we'll go to our. 01:10:05
Mayor Pro Tem. 01:10:08
And I'm. 01:10:11
Pain. 01:10:12
But. 01:10:13
The letter he's talking about. 01:10:16
I received it. I didn't know anybody else received it. I thought the person had sent it to me personally. 01:10:18
And so I was like ohh OK and I didn't respond to it. 01:10:24
And then not until we got on the day as that, I realized everybody had gotten it except him. So it wasn't. I don't think it was at 01:10:27
anyone. Anyone knew that everybody else got it. 01:10:32
I thought it was just sent to me personally. 01:10:38
And then on the day as I, I realized it had been sent to everyone else. 01:10:40
Understood. Yeah, understood. So that I just wanted to say that so. 01:10:44
Steven understands. It didn't go to everyone and everybody wasn't on the distribution list. 01:10:49
Madam Mayor Pro Tem. 01:10:54
This also includes tech messages, so if we get a text message about something. 01:10:56
A community member complaining about something. 01:11:01
Then how are we supposed to handle? 01:11:04
Like that. 01:11:06
This is one of those unresolved issues of the city of San Jose, Case and I I've seen a number of cities take the position that. 01:11:08
Text messages and even certain cities, have made the argument that emails are not documents within the meaning of the government 01:11:17
code. In fact, they are transitory communications more similar to a post it note. 01:11:23
I am unaware of any legal authority that that bolsters that, but certainly the government code cannot be read to. 01:11:29
Require us to keep for a period of two years every post it note we scribble on. 01:11:37
Such such a result would be absurd. Unfortunately, the best answer that I can give you is that the law is very, very slow to 01:11:42
change and adapt to new technologies. 01:11:47
My advice would be. 01:11:53
That text messages and things of that nature, if they don't need to be deleted for I'm going to go into electronically stored 01:11:55
information discovery procedures if they don't need to be deleted as a result of routine operations of systems. 01:12:02
I would recommend retaining them because they might be discoverable in the future. 01:12:08
And an adverse inference instruction in a jury proceeding. 01:12:13
Or a charge that we've failed to comply with Government Code section 34090. 01:12:16
Certainly exposes the city to liability. That being said, there may be an argument in the event we ever find ourselves there that 01:12:21
these are in fact transitory, but I would err on the side of safety. 01:12:26
Given the unsettled nature of law. 01:12:32
I'm glad we're talking about this, because clearly you're all interested. Clearly you want to be reminded. You want to know where 01:12:34
the. 01:12:37
Boundaries are etcetera. So it's a good thing and I'm glad we have our city attorney here. 01:12:39
To assist us in in some of that. 01:12:43
Even though did you hear all that legal jargon in there? Ohh my gosh right. As a recovering lawyer for the last 20 years, not 01:12:46
going to lie gives me a little bit of chills to see how impressive that is. 01:12:51
But but the reality is. 01:12:56
Umm. 01:12:58
A lot of this is just going to be, hey, you know what, When in doubt. 01:12:59
Check. 01:13:03
Just check. 01:13:04
Right. Hey, is this something I need to turn over? If not, I'll just leave it as is. I won't delete it. 01:13:05
Just leave it at is and. 01:13:09
Hopefully no adverse rulings in the future for evidentiary purposes, right? 01:13:10
OK, so. 01:13:15
Umm. 01:13:16
When when it comes right down to it, be mindful. Ohh, good time to stop. We've been sitting. You been sitting there for an hour 01:13:17
and 11 minutes at least. 01:13:20
I think we started a little early. 01:13:23
Take a quick break, right, Come back and what about 5-5 minutes? Enough. 01:13:24
Please do. 01:13:31
Couple of slides, but this whole slide deck I'll certainly make available well. 01:19:47
I think our City clerk has a slide deck right on your laptop there. Now, yes, can be made available to any of you that want to 01:19:51
slide deck. 01:19:54
There are immunities because we want to encourage. 01:19:58
Citizens to engage. 01:20:02
And not have sort of any chilling impact or concern for liability. 01:20:05
We created governmental immunities that provide that. 01:20:08
Provided you maintain your role within that governance team that you're on. 01:20:12
They will continue to work in your favor. 01:20:17
And specifically, for example, as Government Code section 820.9. 01:20:19
Members of city councils, mayors, members of boards of supervisors. 01:20:24
Members of school boards, Members of governing boards of other local public entities. 01:20:28
Members of locally appointed boards, your commissions, etcetera. 01:20:33
Locally appointed or elected advisory boards bodies are by are not vicariously liable for injuries caused. 01:20:36
By the act or omission of the public entity or Advisory Board. 01:20:43
That is a nice thing to have. 01:20:48
Right. Anything like that would be marvelous in anyone's life. 01:20:50
Right. That exists out in the world, so we want to encourage you to participate, so. 01:20:54
If something were to happen, and again I rely on our city attorney to. 01:20:58
Correct any misinterpretation I gave you, but. 01:21:02
If you pass an ordinance or you pass. 01:21:04
You know, measure whatever thing you would be doing. 01:21:07
Legislating as an official member of this governance team. 01:21:10
If somehow that created. 01:21:13
You know, a a situation where somebody in some form was injured or presented a claim to the city. 01:21:16
You cannot be held individually liable provided you are within the bounds of this particular immunity. Does that sound generally 01:21:21
right? 01:21:25
I'm getting a a shaky nod, but there it is. OK, You had your hand up, Mr. Well, you answered my question. OK, OK. 01:21:29
So, but I do have to give you this caveat on this next slide which is. 01:21:35
Nothing in this section exonerates an official from liability for injury caused by that individual's own wrongful conduct. 01:21:39
Right, So it's not like blanket immunity, right? Nothing in this section affects the immunity of any other public official. 01:21:47
So if on an individual basis. 01:21:54
You accessed information that you are not Privy to. Like you know, in the great state of California we have an express. 01:21:57
Right of privacy. 01:22:03
I believe it's under Article One of our Constitution, whereas you know in the United States Constitution it's implied multiple 01:22:05
places, but the right of privacy is implied. 01:22:09
That's sacred here, right? And for example, medical records, we don't don't even put them when we when we receive them. 01:22:14
For a variety of reasons, we don't, when we have in our possession, put them in the regular. 01:22:21
The day-to-day personnel file of the individual, we put them in a separate place for greater security, greater privacy protection. 01:22:26
If one of you happened to access electronic records of an individual. 01:22:33
Learn about information you otherwise should not be able to access or have access to. 01:22:37
And you engage in any sort of invasion of privacy? 01:22:42
Right. Or violate somebody's privacy rights? 01:22:45
That is not protected under this immunity because it is an individual. 01:22:48
Act of wrongful conduct by you outside the course and scope of your role. Yes, Council Member Gamma. 01:22:53
Would if we were accidentally sent something. And as soon as you realize, hey, I shouldn't have this. 01:22:59
What would be the best? 01:23:07
Practice. 01:23:09
Yeah, I would definitely, you know, if you come into possession of any information. 01:23:11
And somehow wrongfully attached to something and we get this in discovery all the time. 01:23:16
Our responsibility ethically as to what? 01:23:21
Only review it enough to figure out, hey, I shouldn't be seeing that. 01:23:23
Their legal litigation strategy? Take that. 01:23:26
Send it back to them, etcetera. You. 01:23:29
Either let somebody know, let HR know, Hey, I was given this information and my. 01:23:32
Council packet. 01:23:36
Right. Was attached to it. It doesn't look like I should have this. You're right, they may say destroy that. 01:23:37
Delete it, shred it, whatever. Or they may say we need that back. 01:23:42
Whatever that instruction is, if you comply with that upon learning. 01:23:46
Right, not studying it. 01:23:50
Blowing it up into a visual. 01:23:52
Anything like that, Upon learning of it, you get the instruction to do what you're supposed to do and you follow it. 01:23:54
I believe you would be just fine. It's inadvertent. 01:23:59
Unintentional. Not, you know, any sort of intent on your part to gain access to that or use it for any reason, or to violate 01:24:01
anyone's rights. 01:24:06
I think you'd be fine. 01:24:10
And I don't hear our city attorney objecting to that. So does that also include acts by individual? 01:24:13
Council members. 01:24:19
They that go against council direction. 01:24:22
On their own, that would be considered a violation of another individual's rights or. 01:24:25
Rights to privacy. 01:24:31
It it it includes any individual actions by a council member that violates somebody else's rights. 01:24:33
Some kind of tort claim? Some kind, whatever it is. 01:24:40
Right. Anything that we do? 01:24:43
As individuals, not as a collective. 01:24:45
Right. And I I'd argue that it is maybe some things you all decided to do that was a wrongful act that wouldn't qualify for the 01:24:48
immunity either. It'd be a conspiracy at that point, right? And then it wouldn't be protected either. Anything to add to that? Our 01:24:52
city attorney would be pretty good there. 01:24:56
And the main thing that I would add is that California law and similar federal laws protect legislators when they're acting in a 01:25:02
in a specifically legislative field. 01:25:06
So the discussions that you have on the day on the dais, acting in the capacity as a representative Council and and passing 01:25:11
ordinances and resolutions in that regard. 01:25:16
That is all pretty. 01:25:21
Protected under legislative immunity. 01:25:24
Once you start acting as an agent of the city individually, without council authorization and things of that nature. 01:25:26
That's where personal liability will attach. 01:25:34
Yeah, and and even if you prevail, what a nightmare and a headache those things are. 01:25:38
Not just from the PR standpoint, but just from your own piece of mind. Laying your head on your pillow at night without this 01:25:42
hanging over your head? Yes. 01:25:45
That suggest that perhaps there should be another caveat. 01:25:51
And the caveat being that. 01:25:54
If your. 01:25:56
Opining or doing something. 01:25:58
Relative to city business. 01:26:01
Right. I mean what I do at my work, what I do. 01:26:04
On my own personal time. 01:26:07
Is one thing but. 01:26:10
If it's related to city business and that's where. 01:26:12
You could. 01:26:16
Could you drag the city into liability situation like. 01:26:17
I don't want to. 01:26:22
Give any specifics, but you understand what I'm saying like yeah and if you're if you're commenting on city business. 01:26:22
Irresponsibly. 01:26:28
Doing an action to try and. 01:26:30
Sway something one way or another that. 01:26:32
I think that's where sounds very Machiavellian right there, right. Yeah, we're out there trying to influence behaviors or change 01:26:35
or support or whatever else. Yeah, there's there's potential for it and I'm sure Mr. Preciado that the plaintiffs bar will throw 01:26:41
whatever they want against the wall and see if it sticks and one of the ones that. 01:26:47
Typically gets thrown out is a 42US code 1983, which is a deprivation of civil rights under color of authority. So even if a 01:26:53
council member or a city agent was. 01:26:58
Not acting within the course and scope of his or her duties, the frequent argument or under some qualified immunity. The frequent 01:27:03
the frequent argument is that. 01:27:07
Some member of the public's rights were violated under color of authority and therefore the city is liable because, let's face it, 01:27:12
the city has deeper pockets. 01:27:16
Small cities doesn't matter, right? There's a JPA out there who will pay, and that's how they look at it. They know, they know the 01:27:21
structure of things, right? Good, good. Pivot over to a JPA, right? What if you're serving on other? 01:27:27
Boards on behalf of the city. 01:27:33
Right. Can you give me some idea of what those would be? I know the one Cal JPA. 01:27:36
Council Member Gamma. You the representative on Cal J PIA, that board. 01:27:41
What other ones would it be? 01:27:45
SCAG Very good. 01:27:47
Who? Who's representing us on that? 01:27:48
Yeah. 01:27:50
Both of you. 01:27:51
Alright, any others that we have? 01:27:52
Are those? 01:27:54
OK. 01:27:59
So, so you're out there. 01:28:02
This is an extension right of your role on this governance team. 01:28:04
And I think each of you would want from the other if there were things relevant to matters pending before the city that. 01:28:08
Everybody came back and discharged their duty and responsibility to keep the governance team informed. 01:28:14
Right. If if Cal JPI was changing their model for. 01:28:19
You know, calculating the experience modification factor, the xmod which determines your contributions every year to maintain your 01:28:23
membership there for general liability for EPL for whatever coverage is out there. 01:28:29
You'd want to know that. You'd want the rest of the governance team to know that so you can decide. 01:28:35
If it should go on an agenda. 01:28:40
Right. And and whatever process we're going through to make sure we get things on the agenda. 01:28:42
I like seeing the word agendas, but I hate that it keeps getting autocorrected in every other document you know and so. 01:28:47
That's that's an important part of it. So that we have a discussion, hey, should we look elsewhere? 01:28:53
Right. For this cover, should we go back to the commercial market? It's soft, right, whatever that is. And so that's the key here. 01:28:58
So that's important for you to keep each other informed. 01:29:02
Especially on things pertaining to the city and the best interest of the city. 01:29:06
But just wanted to give you 1 slide on some stuff here on the top one. 01:29:10
When you're on those boards, you really do us a great service. 01:29:13
And conducting the people's business. 01:29:17
If you are as prepared or just say well prepared there as you would be for any City Council meeting. 01:29:19
You know as as somebody again who ran those those Jpas for so long with my colleagues. 01:29:25
Was a wonderful experience to have that much of the public interest in mind. 01:29:31
And and protecting that almighty sacred tax dollar, right? 01:29:35
And it was always disheartening to see a board member sit down at those JPA meetings. 01:29:38
As back when we had binders mostly right and break the seal on that binder for the first time as they sit down. 01:29:43
To conduct the business of that JPA. 01:29:49
That's tough, right? Because there's so much information that staff went into with all that. So be prepared and be prepared to 01:29:52
analyze that data. 01:29:56
And needs to be analyzed so you can make informed decisions. 01:30:00
For the collective. 01:30:03
Any questions about that? Any disagreement there? 01:30:04
Is it a burden? You just show up and that's OK? 01:30:07
Second one, exercise board member voting rights and cast votes based on the best available information. 01:30:11
And the best interest of the people still think of those four pillars, right? And what that means? 01:30:16
Work through the city manager when seeking any information from that group. 01:30:21
Whether it's a pollution board, an air quality board, a county board of. 01:30:25
You know that were assigned to et cetera. 01:30:29
When there's things that are needed, I know you're the board member. 01:30:31
But still your your job. 01:30:35
Right overall, as a council member, said a vision. 01:30:38
Policies and procedures communicate and champion. 01:30:42
Higher City manager and work through them. 01:30:45
Your board member role there has limitations. 01:30:48
Right. Participate in reading the material. 01:30:51
If you want things from that board, information, some statistics that were cited, et cetera, because it somehow relates to what 01:30:53
we're doing here. 01:30:57
I wonder what it is we're doing here that needs that. Is that your council member governance team role stuff? 01:31:02
Or is it something related to a staff report that's relevant to something that's on the agenda? 01:31:08
If so, that needs to go to the city manager. 01:31:13
That goes to the city manager and the city manager will request that information from that board. 01:31:16
Whatever those things are. 01:31:21
Otherwise, you're getting into the weeds. 01:31:23
And you're starting to look like you're in the. 01:31:25
A place where you shouldn't be. 01:31:28
Any questions about that? That one isn't always clear to us as we see that going on. 01:31:30
And if you work for the city manager, it's the safest thing. 01:31:35
And as you discuss it with them. 01:31:38
You know it, it should be done in a way. 01:31:40
That, again, isn't creating individual action in a conversation that isn't by a sitting governance team. 01:31:42
So we may want to consider how we bring that up, where we bring that up, and if you're not sure. 01:31:49
Ask your city attorney. 01:31:54
Ask your city attorney what would be the best way. 01:31:56
If I believe I need this information. 01:31:58
From this JPA. 01:32:00
That manages our XY and Z. 01:32:02
You know and council. 01:32:05
Member Hernandez is on that board, and I think they could provide us with this data. 01:32:07
Should I just ask the city manager to get that Kevin, or should I, you know, figure that one out through? 01:32:12
The proper channels so that we don't start engaging in business that we shouldn't be engaged in. 01:32:17
As a long one, I know, I apologize. 01:32:22
Force. 01:32:25
Dude. 01:32:28
There's the whole. 01:32:29
Purposely. 01:32:30
Conducting business that would be left to. 01:32:31
Staff. 01:32:34
Yeah. 01:32:35
But it's cold. 01:32:36
Elected officials. 01:32:37
To do so. 01:32:39
Figure out. 01:32:41
When you're being appropriate as to how you're voting on something versus. 01:32:42
Whatever. 01:32:46
I could not have said it better. 01:32:47
It is very untidy. 01:32:49
There's nothing tidy about it, even though you know your role there and your role here. 01:32:51
Where do I go with that? So my this is. 01:32:55
Sorry, I'm on a bit of a soapbox here. 10 seconds. Indulge me, please. 01:32:58
My preference is that these Jpas. 01:33:01
If their governing documents allow it. 01:33:04
Have employees of the city on the boards rather than. 01:33:06
Elected people on the boards. 01:33:09
And I've worked with both. 01:33:12
And it just seems easier and much tidier when it is a. 01:33:13
Umm. 01:33:17
Assistant city manager. 01:33:18
Or a risk manager or someone like that on that board. 01:33:20
Rather than an elected person, but it works. It's worked for years. 01:33:23
And the governing documents of those Jpas dictate that. 01:33:27
So this I. 01:33:31
Served on a JPA for a very long time. 01:33:32
A public agency? 01:33:35
And there were no elected officials on that board. And so I'm wondering why then does the California JPIA? 01:33:36
Insist on having elected officials on the board and I know it's been a long time practice because I forget the ladies name, but 01:33:44
she's been on the executive committee for 30 years. 01:33:49
That's a long time. That's a long time she's from. 01:33:55
I forget her name. She's been an elected person for 30 years and she's been on the executive committee for probably 20 years. 01:33:58
There's something impressive and sick all at the same time there with that, but no. But my experience had always been like, you 01:34:04
know, the elected officials were. 01:34:08
We would report to the board, excuse me. 01:34:13
We would report. 01:34:16
I'm Risk Manager, so I would report, hey, we have this settlement that's above our authority level. 01:34:18
And we would go to the Board of Directors for direction. 01:34:24
But yeah, I just find it very odd that you're. I agree with you that. 01:34:28
All these elected officials on the. 01:34:32
Yeah, they're they're not alone though. Council member game. A lot of pools are like that a lot. We pool JPA. We use them 01:34:34
interchangeably, right? 01:34:38
And so I I don't know why some are, but they and they date way back. You're right, they're governance documents from the outset. 01:34:42
And it'll be up to them to change them if it seems like it makes sense. But. 01:34:48
I think they're like I said, they're one of the. 01:34:52
Finest operating pools and sustainable pools in California. Maybe the country. 01:34:55
Cal JPA. It's a strong pool. 01:35:00
You know the goal one day is that every poll will operate in a way that. 01:35:02
Your contributions overtime. 01:35:05
Are offset by all the risk management and loss prevention. 01:35:07
And those dollars that sit there. 01:35:10
Right. Invested in in life and other things that they have to be because they're public dollars. 01:35:12
They get handled in such a way that the return on that money. 01:35:17
Will cover your contributions for the next year and the next year after that, right? And it keeps kind of self fulfilling. 01:35:20
And the only disasters when catastrophic events happen that create liability that that's not sustainable, but there's there's a 01:35:26
lot of good reasons out there for it. But. 01:35:30
I prefer the tidier way of non elected people, but. 01:35:35
That doesn't mean it's the wrong way to have elected people. I just happen to have a preference there. 01:35:38
So continuing on. So the last thing I already covered, keep the council apprised of your work on whatever board you're on, right? 01:35:43
That's important. We all want to be included so that we're not caught off guard one day. We have to make a big decision. 01:35:49
That could have been, we could have been dealing with or processing for a year or two. 01:35:54
And we're just hearing about it at the crisis moment. 01:35:58
So here are some common pitfalls right that we'll just talk about in general. 01:36:01
And I do want your input on these. 01:36:04
So just there's there's four of them that I selected based on conversations with all of you. 01:36:06
Social media posts, for example, right? We do know in the law, for example. 01:36:11
That social media posts can create liability for cities. 01:36:16
Social media posts can trigger policy offenses by employees. 01:36:21
If they can, reasonably. 01:36:26
You know. 01:36:28
Be determined to be directed at coworkers like a firefighter who has said. 01:36:30
Yeah, it's just my my my opinion. 01:36:34
Right, My constitutionally protected First Amendment right here to say. 01:36:37
I don't think women should be in public safety, especially fire. 01:36:40
If I need one of them to carry out my 250 pound body from a burning building. 01:36:44
You know, how are they going to do that? And so forth and so on. Just exercising rights well. 01:36:48
You know, courts can reasonably determine that those were directed at their female firefighters in the departments. 01:36:52
Right And and hold them accountable for that and allow this uphold the cities decision. 01:36:57
To reprimand them, to demote them, or whatever else happened in those cases. 01:37:02
So likewise. 01:37:06
Sitting council members, elected council members. 01:37:08
Whether appointed or elected. 01:37:12
Making statements on social media. 01:37:14
To piggyback onto something, I think, council member Gamma said. Can they create liability for the city? 01:37:16
And the answer is. 01:37:22
Affirmative from our city attorney. 01:37:23
They can. 01:37:25
So. 01:37:26
You're like the whole world's absolutely entitled to have social media presence. 01:37:27
And a matter of fact, it seems odd. 01:37:33
In this world so driven by social media that an elected person wouldn't have a social media presence. 01:37:35
Except for the one or two who got hacked once or twice and was attributed some horrible things and decided I'm off completely now, 01:37:41
right? 01:37:44
And other things happen like. 01:37:47
A national presence? 01:37:50
Umm. 01:37:52
Very well known and very accomplished influentially. 01:37:53
Congresswoman from New York, Alexandria Ocasio Cortez. 01:37:57
Who had a Twitter account created? 01:38:01
You know that looks like her name. It has her picture on it. 01:38:03
And it just says something like the real AOC or something like that. 01:38:06
And she and the person makes statements as if it's her. 01:38:09
Right. 01:38:12
And Twitter says it's OK. 01:38:14
I don't know if pre Elon Musk Twitter would have said it's OK, but this one does. 01:38:16
And so there's all those challenges like that. 01:38:21
But just be aware. 01:38:24
No one's going to look at that ever and say ohh, they must be saying that as a private citizen. 01:38:26
That is not a positive assumption that is going to be made about you by 9 out of 10 members of the public. 01:38:32
Business holders, stakeholders in the city, et cetera. 01:38:37
They're going to assume you meant it in the worst way possible, and for your own personal reasons. 01:38:40
So be careful with any social media post. 01:38:46
And then another part of that. 01:38:48
Is um. 01:38:50
You. 01:38:51
Umm. 01:38:53
Putting out into the world. 01:38:54
Right, positive things that you're engaged in. 01:38:56
You know, whether it's a beach cleanup some of us talked about. 01:38:59
Other events bringing unity to the city and being inclusive events. 01:39:03
You put those out there as invites. 01:39:07
Somebody shows up because the mayor posted he was going to be there. 01:39:10
And there was going to be some great music and my favorite churros. 01:39:14
And so I show up. 01:39:17
And then I get injured. 01:39:18
Right at it. 01:39:20
And it looks to me like it was a city event. That's the only reason I came. 01:39:21
Was the mayor posted on it that he was going? 01:39:25
And I wanted to be there too. 01:39:27
And then I slip on some sand. I crack a hip. 01:39:29
Little bit of a brain injury. 01:39:33
Autoimmune encephalitis kicks in. 01:39:35
I'm just thinking of a real case and so forth, right? And so. 01:39:37
It happens, right? So any any questions about that? Because those boundaries are so untidy to use that phrase again. 01:39:41
About what's OK to put out there, please. 01:39:49
I'm not. 01:39:54
Talking about public statements or social media, but I am. 01:39:55
Wondering. 01:39:59
About I'm walking through the park. 01:40:00
And I see a risk. 01:40:03
Tomorrow it's got my hat on. 01:40:05
And our report it through Go Gov. 01:40:07
And it doesn't get corrected. 01:40:12
And I think what I'm hearing you say is OK, well then you better talk about it on the Dyess or get an agendas or or something. 01:40:14
Or do I? 01:40:21
Follow up again, Hey, Mr. City Manager, remember. 01:40:23
Pointing this out. Still there, still a risk. 01:40:26
Is. I guess I would ask this question, Council member. 01:40:30
In those four areas of. 01:40:34
Vision. 01:40:36
Policies and procedures. 01:40:37
Championing. Communicating. 01:40:39
And hiring and retaining the city manager and executive leader to. 01:40:41
Implement that vision. 01:40:46
Right. 01:40:48
Does it include anywhere? 01:40:49
In those responsibilities. 01:40:50
You. 01:40:52
Identifying. 01:40:53
Umm. 01:40:55
Risks. 01:40:55
Trip and fall risk It does not. 01:40:57
But I'm a resident and I am accident prone myself and um. 01:41:00
So again, you know. 01:41:05
We have the Go Gov. 01:41:08
Yeah, which is available to all residents. 01:41:10
And um. 01:41:13
But. 01:41:15
This particular resident is a City Council person. 01:41:16
And. 01:41:20
Do I? 01:41:21
Make my request through the go Gov and then just wash my hands of it and say Lavie. 01:41:22
I don't know. 01:41:29
I I guess I'm pushing back on the idea that. 01:41:31
You have to. 01:41:33
Make any notice of it I mean. 01:41:34
I think we would want, it's hard to, it's hard to have a public discussion on this particular subject. The whole point of the 01:41:38
Gogov. 01:41:41
Is for residents to report issues. Graffiti, for example. Graffiti, yes. 01:41:45
You see graffiti? Public. It's on public property. Boom. 01:41:50
The city is aware they got a GPS pinpoint. 01:41:54
Could go take care of it. 01:41:57
So it's a really good service. Ohh, it sounds terrific. 01:41:59
If I may, Council Member Gamma, I think the distinction is is that. 01:42:02
As a resident of the city and like all residents of the city, a council member who came across us trip and fall injury or a trip 01:42:07
and fall liability, issue graffiti or a fallen tree, Any number of those things. 01:42:13
Can report to Gogov and can probably send an e-mail to the city manager via that via the the city's website. 01:42:19
The difference, and one of the things that was warned about earlier, is that taking any steps beyond that you are not acting or 01:42:27
that council member would not be acting within the scope and capacity of a normal citizen. 01:42:33
Suddenly, the City Council member hat goes on. 01:42:40
Suddenly we're providing direction. 01:42:42
Or. 01:42:45
Hinting at official action outside of a regularly agendized meeting. 01:42:45
It's not. 01:42:50
Within. 01:42:51
The scope of where councils are supposed to operate at that level, it's more day-to-day operations. 01:42:53
Personnel management between city manager directors, it gets too far into the weeds. 01:42:59
That being said. 01:43:06
Councils certainly capable of taking note of. 01:43:09
Certain issues within the city. 01:43:13
And there are. 01:43:15
Annual, if not more frequent evaluations of city executive performance. 01:43:16
That might be inappropriate time to evaluate. 01:43:22
We may have some issues with certain performance objectives. 01:43:26
And we need to discuss that, but as far as lobbying or going beyond go, go for a particular outcome. 01:43:29
That's not. 01:43:36
A tool available to the average resident. 01:43:38
Just wanted one other thing then. 01:43:42
And hypotheticals management are abound. So OK, so I do a go Gov. 01:43:45
The significant tripping hazard. 01:43:52
I did one go, go, go. I did another go, go, but now I'm just going to wash my hands of it and I'll deal with it when we come back 01:43:55
from our month long recess and then somebody suffers A catastrophic injury. 01:44:00
And there's a lawsuit. Like I said, brain injury, like a catastrophic injury. We know where that's going to go. 01:44:07
Yeah, right now. 01:44:11
With the JPA. 01:44:15
Want me to come forward and say, hey, by the way, I reported this twice or would you want me and I could tell you me myself? 01:44:17
I would make that information available to the JPA because I would think eventually it's going to come out. 01:44:26
But. 01:44:32
Do you understand what I'm saying? It's like. 01:44:32
Yeah, I understand what you're saying. 01:44:34
For me, it's lacking in some foundational premise, though I think I said our city attorney was pointing that out that. 01:44:36
As a citizen, if you want to identify a tripping hazard that you discovered significant or insignificant, but a tripping hazard, 01:44:42
period. 01:44:46
That using Gogov or an e-mail or anything of the kind. 01:44:51
I think you can do that as any I think you should think could, right. Any citizen can. 01:44:55
But when you start to persist on those things. 01:45:00
It really looks like you're giving an order. 01:45:03
Right of things here, and we can go down the parade of horribles for any potential liability. 01:45:06
Right. That could happen here within the jurisdiction of the city of Port Winema. 01:45:12
Does that mean that all of you should have your risk manager head on looking for things and? 01:45:16
And emailing and go giving them and all the rest, right? 01:45:22
That's not the typical scope of what the people elected you to do. 01:45:26
As far as the business goes? 01:45:30
I can't think of a city. 01:45:33
I can't think of a single city. 01:45:35
That isn't doing its level best to eliminate. 01:45:37
Right within the resources they have. 01:45:41
Any potential liability created as a result of any. 01:45:44
Risk management issue, whether it's tripping hazards, whether it's, you know, we all know that how this street was designed was 01:45:48
pretty sketchy and so forth and so on. 01:45:54
You know, there's only so much they can do and so. 01:45:59
Nowhere in my. 01:46:02
Understanding. 01:46:04
And I. 01:46:06
It's going to be a little bit. 01:46:07
Self aggrandizing maybe, but I've worked with a lot of councils. 01:46:09
And I do consider myself a subject matter expert on the subject of the role of city councils. 01:46:13
And and I just have never seen where that role. 01:46:18
Of being the default risk manager because you're a subject matter expert, no question for the port, I think. 01:46:22
And that that is your responsibility to do that. 01:46:27
If you do it as a citizen, great. 01:46:30
But when you keep doing it, it looks like you're 1 member of a governance team given direction to the city. 01:46:33
Could something happen? Yes. 01:46:38
Right, that's true of just about any observations you make in those things. That tree looks sketchy. 01:46:40
Right, that sundial. 01:46:44
Could be this, that or the other. 01:46:46
So I I'm just rambling now. I just want to say that I just don't see. 01:46:48
Where that would fall into your responsibility. And so the question then of Cal JPIA. 01:46:52
Umm. 01:46:58
They would not want any governance team leader. 01:46:59
Putting their own public entity on notice. 01:47:03
Of potential liability situations unnecessarily. 01:47:08
OK, so you're going to have to unpack that one. 01:47:12
Umm. 01:47:16
I can't think of necessarily, I mean, but but you do agree that? 01:47:17
Any and all residents are encouraged to use Gogov. Ohh absolutely sounds like a great tool. 01:47:23
Now if I take what you just said to heart like 100% sounds like you're saying to me, look, you're a City Council person, you 01:47:28
probably shouldn't be putting the city on notice about risk. 01:47:32
No, what I'm really saying is you should not be. 01:47:37
Creating liability for the city. 01:47:40
I didn't create the tripping hazard, I'm just reporting it. 01:47:43
And there's the liability reporting it. 01:47:46
It has to do with certain provisions relating to notice that are approvable element of premises liability for a public entity. The 01:47:50
rules against public entity or the rules relating to public entities are very different. 01:47:57
Than let's say a private citizens walkway approach to their house or something like that. Grocery store or a grocery store or 01:48:05
something. 01:48:09
And. 01:48:13
Because those rules are different. 01:48:14
And I can understand the concern, the general concern of the public. 01:48:18
The problem lies in that. 01:48:21
And not meaning to speak for the JPIA, but I can. I can put this to the city attorney, for example. 01:48:25
My responsibility. 01:48:31
Is to the corporate entity. 01:48:33
It is not to this Council, it is not to any individual Council member. 01:48:35
It is not to the city manager, it is not to any member of this staff. 01:48:39
My client. 01:48:44
Is the city and I'm obligated to protect my client. 01:48:46
If providing that notice harms my client's interest. 01:48:51
I do not want it. 01:48:56
Now do we want last thing on that is. 01:48:59
Do we want to be made aware of those things through established processes that our city manager? 01:49:02
Ushers in for us because you say in your vision, creating through your strategic planning, we want a safe city. We want these 01:49:09
Gopher holes removed from our field so that kids aren't busting an ankle. 01:49:14
You know, yeah. And then it goes back to performance management of the city manager. 01:49:19
Are we creating safe parks? 01:49:23
Are our sidewalks safer this year than they were last year? I I. 01:49:25
I'm having a hard time with what our city attorney just said, so let me try it this way. 01:49:29
I come in to meet with you, the city manager said. Hey, you know, the Gopher holes are crazy out there. 01:49:34
Just letting you making you aware here, here's a photograph. 01:49:40
And then just leave it at that. 01:49:44
No. 01:49:45
I just feel like I've been told that I've just created liability for the city because I've made the city manager aware of Gopher 01:49:47
holes in a park where kids play. 01:49:51
That is the whole premise of. 01:49:56
Premise liability. 01:49:58
Is duty to inform awareness dangerous condition? Should they have known? Would they have known? Right. I get that. I get all that. 01:49:59
But. 01:50:06
I. 01:50:07
I. 01:50:08
Sounds like I'm being told to ignore it and don't report it. No, that's not what you're being told. What we're being told is let's 01:50:09
use the channel of the governance team. 01:50:13
And let's let's set the direction, council member that says. 01:50:17
Hey, as a governance team, as we do our strategic planning maybe sometime in the fall with the facilitator. 01:50:21
Is one of our priorities for this city over the next year and a half, three years and certainly by 10 years. 01:50:26
To rid ourselves and then have a regular schedule. 01:50:31
Of preventative maintenance. 01:50:34
And getting on top of deferred maintenance 10 years from now, yes, including dangerous conditions. 01:50:37
By. 01:50:43
Inspection of our employees of these locations. 01:50:43
That is where we handle it. We're not ignoring it. No one's ignoring it. 01:50:47
Nobody on this governance team and nobody working for this city wakes up and says. 01:50:51
Ohh, who cares about tripping hazards, right? Or who cares about Gopher holes? 01:50:55
We just want to go through the process that makes sense without creating anything unnecessarily. 01:50:58
So you're. 01:51:05
But if we had it on. 01:51:07
An agenda? 01:51:08
To speak from here as a council. 01:51:11
You know that that in itself is doing the same thing. When we're speaking generally, we're not saying over on Maple Street there's 01:51:14
a 5 inch differential in the sidewalk because of that. 01:51:18
Eucalyptus tree. 01:51:23
And we're not gonna talk about individual. 01:51:24
You know, hazards, we're gonna say in general. 01:51:26
How are we doing on that schedule? 01:51:28
For grinding down the sidewalks that are uneven, right? Well, we identified 14 different ones and we're working on this now, 01:51:30
whatever that would be, right? And we would be covering it that way without speaking to specific issues along those lines. 01:51:37
You've had your hand up along time going back to social media posts, so. 01:51:45
There's a mini beach festival going on. 01:51:49
Can I promote the Miami Beach Festival through my social media and inviting people? Hey, come to the Wanami Beach Festival. It's a 01:51:52
city sponsored event. 01:51:55
Is it a city sponsored event? 01:51:59
Yeah, if it's official city sponsored event. 01:52:01
Then I you know with that, I assume we took all the steps necessary to ensure that. 01:52:04
Whether it's Cal, JPI or somebody else is aware and you know, we, you know, we're covered for those things, then yeah, by all 01:52:08
means, I think that's fine if it's an official city sponsored event. 01:52:13
The only time it gets a little dicey. 01:52:17
Is if it's something you really love and is happening. 01:52:19
And you're promoting it as well through the same medium and so forth. 01:52:22
And then that you used to promote the city events, right? So for me. 01:52:26
This is just me, Mr. Mayor. 01:52:31
I like having a. 01:52:33
Mayor Bobby Martinez's social media presence. 01:52:35
And then a Bobby Martinez social presence, right social media presence for these different things and only on this one do you 01:52:39
promote city specific city sponsored events, official ones? 01:52:43
And on this one you know events that you enjoy and appreciate and maybe even because I I am still a lawyer at heart. 01:52:48
Still license, I just don't and represent individual clients. 01:52:56
I might even want a little. 01:53:00
Disclaimer on there. 01:53:01
Right at the beginning of that one. Small letters, but a disclaimer nonetheless. 01:53:03
That shows this is you. 01:53:07
This is not official, I use this. 01:53:09
A mechanism, this medium, for promoting things that I enjoy. 01:53:12
And are not officially sponsored events of the City of Port Winding. 01:53:16
I've seen that done and it looks pretty nice that way. 01:53:20
And they're both good. 01:53:22
Yes. 01:53:25
Council member, I'm sorry, is your mic on? 01:53:33
Think you have social media page but I have one under my name. 01:53:36
Without my title. 01:53:40
And I generally put anything out there that's going on in the city that's on the city web page. 01:53:42
Things that I like that are not part of the city, that are other things that the community might like to go out to. So should I 01:53:49
not be doing that? That's one of the things that I picked up because I'm hearing a lot that our community is not hearing about 01:53:53
events. 01:53:57
So I'm trying to do my part. Ohh that's great form, but what shouldn't I be doing? 01:54:02
To the extent you are able. 01:54:07
My answer is the same to everybody who asked me that question, and that is. 01:54:09
Make sure that it is clear. 01:54:13
This is a Martha McQueen lejohn. 01:54:15
You know personal preference here and not a city sponsored event because you are a public figure as a council member. 01:54:18
Of the city. And so I like that. Cleaner, too different. 01:54:25
Social media context there, and by the way, that doesn't guarantee somebody's not gonna come back at us. 01:54:29
From the plaintiff sports still try and throw all this. 01:54:34
Fecal matter against the wall and see what sticks here. But it is cleaner and I do like it better that way. But that's just one 01:54:36
person's opinion. 01:54:40
Can you, let's just say you do have two separate Instagram accounts? 01:54:45
And can you still promote stuff through your personal because there's people that you'd be reaching through your personal that you 01:54:49
won't reach through your other account. 01:54:52
I think then you defeat the purpose of having the two separate ones. 01:54:56
OK. Yeah. 01:55:00
Because the One is the private, private Bobby Martinez, cool citizen of Port Wanami and Ventura County. 01:55:01
And the other one is the mayor. 01:55:07
And then that's just, that is just your advice it there isn't anything against having one Instagram account. 01:55:09
That is correct. That is Jerry Preciado squarely 100% advice. 01:55:14
Based on experience to to add a little bit more on that the the issue is is that. 01:55:19
You can create. 01:55:26
Public forums. 01:55:28
And limited public forums. 01:55:29
And the argument becomes that if you haven't maintained a private space, that's clearly an individual account. 01:55:30
Once you've created a public forum, you can no longer moderate it. 01:55:36
You can no longer engage engage in content discrimination. 01:55:39
You can no longer remove posts. 01:55:42
You lose pretty much. 01:55:45
All of your ability to control that. 01:55:46
So. 01:55:49
And and as we saw with former President Trump, if you block somebody on some of those accounts, you can be individually liable as 01:55:49
well. 01:55:53
You know, that's far more in depth than I appreciate that answer and I will remember that statement the next time I share this 01:55:59
information because that makes a lot of sense in that context. 01:56:03
And so have we created We. We can't say because we don't have all the facts. 01:56:08
But have we created this public forum under Bobby Martinez Instagram account? You're the mayor, you're promoting these things. 01:56:13
Other people comment and they do other things. 01:56:19
We we did have to be looked at on a case by case basis, right, But. 01:56:21
You know, we we just want to be clear and and again. 01:56:25
We speak with them. 01:56:27
Mindset and a filter and a paradigm of a parade of horribles, right? And try to anticipate and predict things that can happen to 01:56:30
give you the best advice to keep you safe. 01:56:34
This is all about. 01:56:39
Helping 5. 01:56:41
Civic minded. 01:56:42
Well intended. 01:56:45
Loving Port Winema citizens who are also government leaders. 01:56:46
Be as safe as you can be. 01:56:50
And create a safer and safe. 01:56:52
Port Manimi as well in that context. 01:56:56
So that's where this is all coming from, the public statements, I think that one self-explanatory, right? 01:56:59
Anything you say you you may say things like off the record, I'm not speaking as mayor. 01:57:04
But does any of that really counts? No. 01:57:10
No, and I think you've probably all been misquoted, misunderstood, or or or misstated. 01:57:13
Et cetera. And so it happened, so just be aware. 01:57:18
Public statements. 01:57:21
Are always going to have your council member hat on. I know there's no specific law that says that I'm covering Kevin right now 01:57:23
for the moment, right? 01:57:26
But there's enough practice out there that that's the safest harbor I can give you. 01:57:31
Don't do it or don't say it thinking you can say it as a private citizen. 01:57:35
When you are a council member, when you are the mayor, Pro Tem, et cetera. Any questions about that? 01:57:39
So a couple others. I know we covered this in the very beginning, but even the appearance of impropriety, what does it look like? 01:57:46
There's my example, which was very private. 01:57:50
And Original Joe's in downtown San Jose. 01:57:54
But then there's others. 01:57:56
Where, you know, we're pretty small community where people know you. 01:57:58
Long before you were a member of council, you were out there leading cleanups. You were out there. 01:58:03
Doing a a variety of things. 01:58:08
And so you find yourself at the Marina not far from here. 01:58:09
And there is a developer who has an incredible boat. Maybe you've known them for a long time, long before you were a volunteer and 01:58:13
a council member. 01:58:16
And they take you on their boat. Everybody sees you getting on there's. 01:58:21
You know the Marina website posting pictures of recent events and this developer who happens to be looking for a variance from our 01:58:24
Planning Commission. 01:58:28
Is taking you fishing for the day. 01:58:32
For whatever that thing is. But Jerry, I've been doing this for 25 years. 01:58:35
I've been going on his annual weekend fishing trip for 25 years. You mean I gotta stop? 01:58:39
That's my answer. 01:58:43
Avoiding the appearance of impropriety. 01:58:45
You will never regret. You won't. 01:58:48
Umm. 01:58:51
Having somebody have a field day. 01:58:52
Because this person got their variance. 01:58:54
And now they're going to be able to do XY or Z. 01:58:57
And now they're just all upset. And then this picture of you. 01:59:00
On this boat. 01:59:03
With this fish. 01:59:05
Right. And A and a course in the other hand. 01:59:06
Problematic. Problematic. Do you remember that famous boat called Monkey Business? 01:59:09
All too well. 01:59:15
If you're old enough, you remember that one, right? So just avoid that and then. 01:59:16
Conversations with city employees about work. One of you shared with me them a recent. 01:59:22
Experience where you understood. 01:59:28
That employees were told. 01:59:31
They shouldn't engage with you. 01:59:33
Right. 01:59:35
And they shouldn't engage in dialogue or conversation with you. Kind of like avoid you. 01:59:36
Which? 01:59:41
I I don't think it's the. 01:59:42
The best strategy in the world. I understand why somebody might give that. 01:59:44
But I don't think it's the best strategy in the world. And and we do want to keep you safe, but not to the point where all of a 01:59:49
sudden you feel like persona non grata come into the city, right? 01:59:53
We do want you to be able to connect with the employees, but mostly as a leader. 01:59:58
Thank them. 02:00:02
Be grateful for them. Express your appreciation for all they're doing for the citizens. 02:00:04
Stakeholders and businesses of this great city. 02:00:09
That's something you can do. 02:00:11
Right, and and I encourage you to do so, Catch them doing good. 02:00:13
Right. Don't feel the need to be home monitors of the employees when you're here at the city because you are the ultimate bosses 02:00:19
and you are. 02:00:22
Because their ultimate boss. 02:00:26
Is it reports to you? 02:00:29
Right. So that part is OK. 02:00:31
If if questions come up about and I have a an employee I'm working with in another city. 02:00:34
In Southern Cal, who has tremendous access? 02:00:40
To the Council. 02:00:43
And talks to two council members on a regular basis. 02:00:45
And they're not related. They're not dating. Nothing like that. 02:00:48
They just know that she is a get it done gal. I've always wanted to be a get it done guy. 02:00:51
Because then people can really count on you, you know? But she's a get it done gal and so. 02:00:57
Going around her boss. She's a manager. The boss is a director. 02:01:02
They say hey, they'll call her. They'll text her and say hey. 02:01:06
This island over on such and such city. 02:01:09
Are such and such part of the the city? 02:01:12
And there's this And boom. 02:01:14
Within 48 hours, it's done. 02:01:15
It's done. 02:01:17
And so now her boss gives her direction and whatnot. 02:01:19
And that very little. 02:01:22
Impact on her. 02:01:24
If the two council members. 02:01:25
Aren't in agreement with what the director is saying or wants. 02:01:28
It started off as just conversations about, hey, what's your favorite part of the job? 02:01:32
I like the stuff that's forward facing to the residents that that's how it started, right? 02:01:37
And that's fine, but it just went too far. 02:01:42
And now this relationship I'm trying to undo because. 02:01:44
The director is ready to separate her for insubordination and for a number of other things. 02:01:47
And how's that going to fly when the city manager knows that she's a favorite of two council members, right? 02:01:53
All kinds of untidy things happen when we go too far in our conversations. 02:01:59
You know, including one that was started like this. 02:02:03
We'll say that Bobby is the employee, right? And I'm the council member. 02:02:07
Hey, Bobby. 02:02:10
Maple Street Park. 02:02:11
The way that those garbage cans are being emptied on a more regular basis now. 02:02:13
Fantastic. 02:02:18
And that's how it starts, just like that. So there's one way to show appreciation, which is, hey, thanks for all you're doing, but 02:02:21
then you get down into the weeds too much with details like that, and all of a sudden it turns into this dysfunctional 02:02:24
relationship. 02:02:28
An unhealthy relationship that could be creating all kinds of problems. 02:02:33
For managing that city on a day-to-day basis, so be careful. 02:02:36
That's the potential pitfall right now. I have no comment to add to that. If somehow one of you is married to an employee of the 02:02:39
city, that is what it is and you do your very best as an elected person myself. 02:02:46
Being married to somebody in a unit, I was on a school board. 02:02:52
And my wife was heavily involved with a. 02:02:56
A. 02:02:58
Parent group for gifted students. 02:03:00
And wanted to make sure that we were going to fund certain things. 02:03:03
We kept it separate, right? I'm looking at our mayor Pro Tem. We kept it separate. She didn't bother me too much about things and. 02:03:07
I kept that firewall up pretty good to not let her know I'm privileged information. Things like that. Because you have to. We 02:03:13
trusted you to do that. All of you. 02:03:17
And to my knowledge, you're doing a good job. You really are on so many things, we just have to Polish up a few. So thanks, thanks 02:03:21
for keeping that balance. 02:03:25
And thanks for doing all that. It's not easy. It's not easy. I'll grant that. Especially for somebody who's not a very good secret 02:03:30
keeper like me. 02:03:33
And had good news and wanted to share it but I couldn't Right kind of thing. 02:03:37
So, well done. I'm balancing all that and those conversations. 02:03:40
Stay out of those as much the extent possible with all of it. 02:03:44
So all I wanted to say here on this one, I'm looking at how that's two different colors. 02:03:47
This that you have created. 02:03:52
It's as good a document as I've seen like it. 02:03:57
And so you're all familiar with this? 02:04:01
That I'm holding right here. It was signed by. 02:04:04
All of you, I believe, except. 02:04:08
Martha. 02:04:12
Sorry, council member McQueen Lejohn. Maybe it was just too much for me, Martha. 02:04:13
Were you all here last November? 02:04:21
I believe it was. 02:04:23
Yeah. 02:04:24
Ohh. Rollins was here comma Hernandez Perez Martinez, Yeah. 02:04:25
So the amended parts. 02:04:29
Last September. 02:04:32
I was voted on and on November 9. 02:04:34
And it shows all of you as. 02:04:37
Unanimous vote including Rollins. 02:04:38
Right when this was done. 02:04:41
According to the good records of our city clerk, which is why we have those. 02:04:42
Do all. 02:04:46
Believe in this document and what it's intended for. 02:04:48
It is a good document. 02:04:54
And and knowing that you all voted for in the affirmative, with the one exception. 02:04:56
But I'm comfortable in my interview. 02:05:00
With the Council member McQueen Lejohn, that she is absolutely committed to this. 02:05:02
Then I applaud you. 02:05:07
Because. 02:05:08
The challenge is once we pass it. 02:05:09
Is it going to modify our behavior? And I do see that I'm out of time. 02:05:12
And so here's what I want to say to you. There are measures in here. 02:05:15
For structure driving behavior. 02:05:20
There are civility aspects in here. There are professionalism aspects. There are nicely delineated statements in this 34 page 02:05:23
document. 02:05:27
That reminds you of how, what, when, right, and where we do things. 02:05:32
And the expected behavioral norms for professionalism. 02:05:37
For courtesy and civility. 02:05:40
And I applaud you for that. There are many councils that will refuse to pass a document like this because they don't want to be 02:05:43
bound by it. 02:05:46
And then others will change and and we'll try it again. We'll get some traction. It won't happen. 02:05:50
But this is only a piece of paper. 02:05:54
If we're not adhering to it. 02:05:57
And so structure drives behavior. 02:05:59
And my last thought. 02:06:02
When it comes right down to it. 02:06:05
In the world of checks and balances. 02:06:07
This one you have to check each other. 02:06:09
Right. I understand how uncomfortable it is because I've been present for a lot of these. 02:06:13
When? 02:06:18
A motion is made. 02:06:19
For a discussion on Dada Dada. 02:06:22
And it's about something related to the censure of a member of the governance team. 02:06:25
And it can get really challenging, I get that. 02:06:30
But those typically don't come up just Willy nilly or randomly or pulled out of the sky. 02:06:33
If somebody said something, did something, behaved in a certain way and you feel like that's not right. 02:06:39
And it's not in compliance with our own policy and procedures for this council. 02:06:45
It is OK to say hey that is not OK and if it's a pattern like OK. 02:06:49
Clearly they're not getting the message. 02:06:54
You know, we do need to have on the agenda. 02:06:56
You know, a a discussion about and of course our city attorney would. 02:06:58
Would ensure that we are crossing all our T's and dotting all our eyes for that agenda item to ensure we can discuss it. That 02:07:02
doesn't follow that there will be adequate evidence. 02:07:07
For the rest of you to say hey. 02:07:12
This does warrants. 02:07:14
Right demotion from Mayor Pro Tem. 02:07:16
This does warrant censure. This does warrant. It may not be there based on the facts that are presented. 02:07:18
But it might. 02:07:24
And if not you, then who? Who's supposed to govern you in that way? 02:07:26
So on the one hand, I say to you. 02:07:30
It is uncomfortable in those moments. 02:07:35
But you are not just judge discharging your duties and responsibilities. 02:07:38
A reference was made by our city attorney to basically a fiduciary duty, right? 02:07:42
You are not conducting the people's business if you are not holding each other accountable. 02:07:47
To this part of what your role is as a governance team. 02:07:52
So it's like I don't want to do that. Now I'm not saying you have to do it. That's the only way to solve it. 02:07:56
It could be an individual dialogue with the person by our mayor or some other situation. 02:08:00
Short of that, some informal resolution to it. 02:08:06
A commitment to cease and desist, that kind of thing. 02:08:09
But when it happens, it is just a process that we go through and that we're structured for and that you all agreed to. 02:08:13
Right. And so we should do it. 02:08:19
If it's needed. 02:08:21
And if it's not needed, then we won't do it. 02:08:22
If it's brought up and not seconded, it won't happen. 02:08:25
But if it's happening and in your heart you know what's happening, you need to support it. 02:08:28
At least through its due process components. 02:08:32
And then see what happens. 02:08:35
You can't just always avoid it and expect it to change. 02:08:37
You just cannot right as part of that. 02:08:40
Well, I started off with this. 02:08:43
Individually. 02:08:45
I appreciated meeting each one of you. 02:08:46
I don't believe with the talent level and experience that you bring to the table that there is a weak link on this City Council. 02:08:49
I believe that you have what it takes to be the best version of a governance team for the city of Port Wanami to achieve what it 02:08:54
can achieve. 02:08:59
If you all get into alignment with all of this. 02:09:03
And avoid things. 02:09:06
Like those adverse impact tones? 02:09:08
Avoid thing like making. 02:09:10
Statements personal. 02:09:13
Right. And avoid anything. 02:09:15
That has any appearance that you are about your business and not the city's business. 02:09:17
And sometimes those can be. 02:09:22
Very muddy for those of us watching you work. 02:09:25
So I share with you that if you stay in your role, setting a vision. 02:09:28
Passing policies and procedures, championing, communicating, ensuring people know what we're trying to accomplish, and then hiring 02:09:33
a good city manager to be the boots on the ground to get it done. 02:09:38
And move that needle of achievement. 02:09:43
You were going to do well by the city. 02:09:44
You're gonna achieve much, and we're all going to applaud you for it. 02:09:46
The disharmony that has happened in the past does not have to reflect our future. 02:09:49
You will get as much credit or more. 02:09:54
For creating more harmony going forward than the disharmony we've experienced in the past. And you'll deserve every ounce of that 02:09:56
credit. 02:10:00
Thank you so much for making time for me today. 02:10:04
And just as a sneak preview, in July we'll be talking more about. 02:10:06
Communication. 02:10:11
And conflict resolution, how we deal with it, how we manage it, because conflict is going to happen. We all know that, right? That 02:10:12
should be the bumper sticker. Conflict happens not. Other things happen. Right. So thanks, everybody. I appreciate your time and 02:10:18
your attentiveness. I mean that to all five of you. Thank you. Yes, thank you, Mr. Preciado. 02:10:24
Guess we're we're done with our meeting. The next regular meeting is scheduled for Monday, July 3rd at 4:00 PM. 02:10:33
I'd like to adjourn the meeting. The time is now 5:08 PM. 02:10:39
Link
Start video at
Social
Embed
* you need to log in to manage your favorites
My Favorites List
You haven't added any favorites yet. Click the "Add Favorite" button on any media page, and they'll show up here.
* use Ctrl+F (Cmd+F on Mac) to search in document
Unable to preview the file.
* use Ctrl+F (Cmd+F on Mac) to search in document
Unable to preview the file.
Welcome everyone to the. 00:02:18
City Council regular meeting. I'm calling this meeting to order. The time is now 3:00 PM. 00:02:20
Madam Clerk, can you please take roll? 00:02:26
Council Member Gamma. 00:02:29
Here, Council Member Hernandez. 00:02:32
Here. 00:02:34
You said regular meeting. It's a special meeting. Ohh my bad. It says my apologies. Just want to make sure I'm here at the special 00:02:35
meeting. 00:02:39
Council member Hernandez here, Council Member McQueen, Lesean. 00:02:44
Here. 00:02:49
Mayor Pro Tem Perez here and Mayor Martinez present. 00:02:49
All right. 00:02:58
We will now hear public comments soon. Participants, please use the Raise Your Hand feature if you would like to comment. 00:02:58
You will have 3 minutes to provide comments. 00:03:05
Madam Clerk. 00:03:07
Does anybody in the public have a comment? 00:03:08
There are no public comments. 00:03:11
OK. 00:03:14
Are our business item for today's governance role training session one? 00:03:15
I will now turn it over to our presenter. 00:03:21
Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Appreciate that. 00:03:30
I I'm grateful to be with you today. I'm grateful to see you all today. 00:03:32
And having heard so much about our city attorney through other circles and these. 00:03:37
Good to meet our City attorney face to face for the first time. 00:03:42
So thank you. Thank you for taking the time out of your busy schedules. I I sure do appreciate that. 00:03:45
And I also appreciated. 00:03:50
The opportunity that I had to to meet all of you. 00:03:52
Taking time that day. 00:03:56
And whether here or or via zoom to chat with me. 00:03:58
About the nature of these relationships. 00:04:02
Our city as a whole, it was very evident to me. 00:04:05
After speaking with all of you. 00:04:09
That the one thread that absolutely binds you together. 00:04:11
Is your desire your genuine and sincere desire? 00:04:15
To want the best and to try and achieve the best for the city of Port Wanami. 00:04:19
So I I applaud you for that. I do believe. 00:04:24
With all my heart that um. 00:04:27
You are evidence to me of of the absolutes. 00:04:30
Purest form of democracy because people. 00:04:34
In a representative government. 00:04:38
Like we have. 00:04:40
Often don't have access to our representatives. It's not easy to get to a Congress person. Maybe for some of you it would be or 00:04:41
others who have a local person. 00:04:45
You know, even state assembly, State Senate in California. 00:04:49
Or United States Senators, United States Congress, people hard to really feel like they're representing your interest when they 00:04:53
have so many to represent. 00:04:57
This is different. 00:05:01
If I'm a resident of of Port Winema, I might run into Laura at the council member Hernandez at the grocery store. 00:05:03
Right. I might run into our good mayor at a laundromats or a beach events or something else. 00:05:10
And I'm going to bend your ear a little bit, right? Why can't this happen or that happened and so forth. 00:05:16
And people will complain, in case you didn't know. 00:05:22
Right. So you are truly a pure form of democracy, and I appreciate that. 00:05:26
And and that's kind of where this story begins. We. 00:05:30
We come together. 00:05:33
And we're ordinary citizens. 00:05:35
Sometimes, though, we have extraordinary backgrounds, and in my discussion with you I learned a bit about each of you. 00:05:37
And the story that your life tells. 00:05:43
Your education, your work experience, whatever that is. 00:05:45
And we come together with five talented people. 00:05:49
And the concern that I run into. 00:05:53
Not more often than not, but often enough. 00:05:55
Is that 5? 00:05:58
Really capable and talented people. 00:06:00
Come together. 00:06:04
And can form a rather ordinary governance team. 00:06:05
That is the challenge. 00:06:10
That I run into often, but not more often than not. 00:06:11
And there are situations here on your team where you are, I believe, a better than ordinary citizens. I think with some of your 00:06:15
backgrounds, you're quite extraordinary. 00:06:19
And we need to address some of the things. 00:06:25
That can help us achieve. 00:06:27
That same level. 00:06:29
As a collective. 00:06:31
Right. Often people are driven to be part of something bigger than themselves. I know I've been driven that way, and I don't want 00:06:32
to project my paradigm as if everybody is. 00:06:36
But certainly this is one of those things, the potential. 00:06:41
For this city. 00:06:44
To be the best version of it can, it can be with the five of you leading it, and I do mean the five of you, because you are the 00:06:45
highest level of leadership in this city of Port Wanami. 00:06:50
The potential is immense. It is great. 00:06:57
And you can lead us into the best version of the city of Port Winema that we've ever been. 00:07:00
If not you, then who? 00:07:05
Right. That's the message and and we've put faith in you and when I say we as a reference to the people, right and. 00:07:07
And and this idea of. 00:07:14
We formed this government not to abdicate our responsibility or our ownership. 00:07:16
But because we entrust you with the public trust. 00:07:21
And that's what we're going to start once I get through a couple of admonitions and I'm sure you can see on the screen. 00:07:24
In front of you here I don't want any of you. 00:07:29
To let history. 00:07:32
Rob, you of any hope that we can be any different than what we have been? 00:07:34
You absolutely. 00:07:39
Can be. 00:07:40
More productive? More efficient? More effective. 00:07:42
Than we have been in the past. 00:07:46
You can be equally successful in areas where you've been successful in the past, because I don't want to suggest for a minute. 00:07:47
That you haven't accomplished much because you have. 00:07:53
The civic minded people coming together can always accomplish the will of the people. 00:07:56
When they have their mindset to it and they can remove any artificial obstacles that are placed before them. 00:08:01
But some part of our history here has led to the point. 00:08:07
We're on this, Council. 00:08:10
There has been experience and experience of dysfunction, disharmony, some dissension and some discord. 00:08:12
That does not make you unique. There are many governance teams that experience that and. 00:08:19
Can get past that. 00:08:24
Right. And so I don't want any of our history. 00:08:26
To rob us of any idea. 00:08:29
That we can't be can be a harmonious, effective, productive. 00:08:31
Efficient dischargers. 00:08:35
As a governance team and as individual council members. 00:08:37
That's my personal maxim. Histories to be learned from, not lived in. 00:08:40
And you've all heard the other one the more famous statement about history. Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to 00:08:44
repeat it. 00:08:46
Winston Churchill gets credit for it. Like so many other quotes, even though he was not the first person to say it, he did say it. 00:08:50
But but the reality is we can learn from history, so we don't repeat it. 00:08:57
But we don't have to live in it either. 00:09:01
Let's live in the here forward. 00:09:04
We have a finite amount of energy on any given day. Yours is balanced between. 00:09:06
Your day work, and whatever else you fill your life with. 00:09:10
And then your civic duty that you commit to this great city and its residents. 00:09:13
If we said this bottle. 00:09:17
Represented. 00:09:19
For us a, you know, full complement of liquid energy. 00:09:20
That we get on a daily basis. 00:09:24
And I recall in my meeting with the Council Member Gamma. 00:09:26
He had a lot of energy, you know, he just come in from. 00:09:29
Where he was working and I could feel his energy and my guess is he probably rides his bike to work and all these other things, 00:09:32
no? 00:09:36
So we all have a full complement of energy. 00:09:40
But all of us, no matter how much we have, when we meet that person, that seems to have limitless energy, right? 00:09:44
We still have a finite amount. 00:09:49
Given how much finite amount we have on a daily basis? 00:09:51
Why would we waste any of it? 00:09:54
On things we cannot change. 00:09:57
Like the past. 00:09:59
Let's not do that as a governance. Let's not keep trudging up the past. 00:10:01
Thinking somehow that's going to benefit our future. Instead, let's become what we call energy efficient human beings. 00:10:05
Use our energy here forward, right looking at my watch 308 June 27/20/23 forward. 00:10:13
That's what we do. 00:10:20
If we want to be. 00:10:22
Professionally fulfilled. One of the characteristics of the happiest people I know. There are energy efficient human beings. They 00:10:24
don't waste any of it on the past, not even 5 minutes ago. 00:10:28
With all the talent in this room. 00:10:33
We can't even change 10 minutes ago, let alone. 00:10:35
A year ago, six months ago, whenever that thing happened, right? 00:10:38
So why waste it? Let's not. Let's put ourselves in positions to be successful going forward. And that's what this meeting is 00:10:43
about. 00:10:46
Being energy efficient, human beings leaving the past where it belongs. 00:10:49
And moving forward. 00:10:52
Right. With a set of understanding about how we're going to engage, when we engage, how we engage. 00:10:54
And really, some reminders. 00:10:59
I don't expect that anything I say to a group, this experience like yourselves. 00:11:01
Is going to be revolutionary. 00:11:06
Or remarkable. 00:11:08
But it will help us get on the same page. 00:11:09
And align our unique paradigms. 00:11:12
So don't let history rob you. 00:11:16
Of a different future. 00:11:18
Don't keep looking backwards. 00:11:20
Look forward. 00:11:22
And use our energy where we can so finite amount. The the 2nd admonition I just want to give to you is this one this Tolstoy Very 00:11:23
ironic Tolstoy comment. 00:11:27
Everybody wants to change the world. 00:11:32
But nobody wants to change themselves. What's the irony? Who's the one person we can change? 00:11:34
That's it ourselves. 00:11:41
As I see the mayor pointing to himself, right, that's it. And is that an easy proposition, by the way? 00:11:43
When we hit those reset buttons on January, one last many of us do. 00:11:48
New year, I'm gonna, I'm gonna own this year. 00:11:52
And we set goals. What does the research tell us about the average amount of time that people? 00:11:55
Are able to maintain their commitment to their New Year's resolutions. Any guesses? 00:12:00
Three months. 00:12:06
That's a common guest. 00:12:07
That's a guess. That's a common guess. People think three months. 00:12:09
I think there's a lot of you out there that are three months on those goals, right? The research tells us. 00:12:12
Four days. 00:12:18
So, Madam Mayor Pro Tem, if you're doing it for three months, you're way above average. You really are. I'm pretty average, I 00:12:21
think, when it comes to New Year's resolution. So what's my point? 00:12:25
Imagine. 00:12:31
If everybody. 00:12:33
Working for the best interests. 00:12:35
Of the city of Port Wanami. 00:12:37
Was focused on themselves, starting with this leadership team. 00:12:39
You are just focused on you. 00:12:43
Right. All this introspective analysis going on. 00:12:45
Right. What can I do to be the best governance team member I can be to be the best mayor, best council member, et cetera? 00:12:49
How am I contributing to the success of this thing we're trying to achieve? 00:12:55
How am I? Am I an obstacle? Am I part of the problem or am I part of the solution here? 00:12:59
If everyone of you and then following your example. 00:13:05
Every employee of this city and service provider and everybody else were committed on to, committed to, focusing on themselves. 00:13:08
Myoma, the things we could accomplish if that were the case. 00:13:17
Right. Amazing things would happen. We'd waste. 00:13:21
Zero energy worrying about ohh what my fellow officer is doing right, My fellow patrol officer on my shift. Why does he get to 00:13:23
come in at such and such a time? How come I don't get these many days off? How come they get to you know, let's just focus on us, 00:13:28
what we have control over. 00:13:33
How we do our job, how we discharge our duties and responsibilities, et cetera. 00:13:39
Sometimes we come to a session like this. We might think ohh. 00:13:43
This is not quite what I expected. 00:13:46
I'm sure glad that Council member so and so is here, because they need to hear this. 00:13:48
With in fact, what we really need to be focused on is. 00:13:53
How am I gonna be part of the best practices we're talking about here? 00:13:56
How am I going to be part of the solutions? 00:13:59
If each one of the five of you is focused on that. 00:14:01
Then we will accomplish much this afternoon, we really will. So I appreciate the opportunity to share that with you. I do feel a 00:14:05
little bit like I'm preaching to the choir on some of this stuff. 00:14:09
But I want to give us those reminders so we all start on the same page. One other thing before we jump into the first things I 00:14:15
want to talk about. 00:14:18
In the work that I do when I'm not doing specific work like this with governance teams. 00:14:22
I'm what you call a professional wedge remover. 00:14:27
Right, my clients call me. 00:14:30
And they say, hey Jerry, I got this issue going on in my public works department. Can you come in and figure out what's going on 00:14:31
with the streets crew? 00:14:34
Can you come in and figure out what's going on in my C shift? And my fire department? Got a lot of conflicts on turnover, some 00:14:37
stress claims. 00:14:41
And we come in and figure out what is the source of the conflict, what are the behaviors driving that conflict. 00:14:45
How is it being handled? By leadership, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. And then by the end, we'll know, OK, here's what needs to 00:14:50
stop happening, here's what needs to start happening. 00:14:54
And one of the things that inevitably comes up, I can't think of a project in the last 20 years that I've been doing this. 00:14:58
Where this slide didn't come up and so I share it with you now. 00:15:05
Because I experienced it as I spoke with some of you. 00:15:10
How our tone changes when we're talking about certain other members of the council. 00:15:14
Right, when we're describing what the challenges are. 00:15:19
And who may be the one creating the challenge? 00:15:22
These tones, there's never, ever a justification. 00:15:25
For using these tones, they are 10 adverse impact tones. 00:15:28
And they usually come up in a way. 00:15:34
That if we're on the dice like this and. 00:15:37
You know, we have our our debate going on even though we have these. Wonderful. 00:15:40
You know, policies and procedures for our Council that were amended just about, gosh, not even a year ago. 00:15:46
And it talks about the stability and the professionalism, et cetera, that needs to transpire. 00:15:53
These tones which are neither civil. 00:15:58
Nor respectful. 00:16:00
Right, nor courteous still manifest themselves. 00:16:01
And there's zero justification for it. 00:16:04
I believe that the trust that's been placed in you. 00:16:08
By the members of this residence of this great city and all the other stakeholders who count on you. 00:16:11
Never in their mind thought, yeah, we want our council member who we supported. 00:16:16
To be up there using sarcastic tones. 00:16:20
Right. We want our council member up there to be a negative net or a negative Nelly about everything that's being said. 00:16:23
We want to condescending or its cousin patronizing tone to exit our council members voice right as they share things. So these are 00:16:29
they condescending, patronizing, angry, sarcastic, judgmental. 00:16:35
Frustrated and patient, negative accusatory and intolerance. 00:16:41
And the one I would say that does the most damage. 00:16:45
By way of city harmony. 00:16:48
By way of cultural. 00:16:50
You know, climates, that allows us to be the best version of us as elected, appointed or employees of the city. 00:16:52
Is accusatory. 00:16:58
The accusatory tone that comes out. 00:17:00
People just assume because they think it that it's universally true. 00:17:02
You know you're not doing XYZ and therefore you don't get it at A. 00:17:07
Right. It's an accusatory tone. 00:17:11
And there's just no place for it. 00:17:14
In in society like this. 00:17:15
In a governance team like this where I've met you. 00:17:18
And I have sensed from each of you, I'm not perfect. I'm not a perfect measure of things. 00:17:21
But I have felt from each of you. 00:17:25
You're impassioned desire. 00:17:27
To be here for a different civil civic reason, perhaps. 00:17:29
But to be here in service to others, we just don't ever need to use these adverse impact tones. Any question about that? 00:17:32
Before I press forward with. 00:17:40
Other matters. 00:17:43
I'm not saying you always have to have a Mr. Roger Stone either, right? 00:17:46
When somebody upsets you or uses an accusatory tone at you. 00:17:50
But I also say that you don't have to mirror that tone back. 00:17:54
Somewhere between data input. 00:17:57
And to your personal paradigm. 00:17:59
Before your data output, which is your reaction or your response. 00:18:01
Is that golden moment for you to decide? 00:18:05
Or for you to follow a commitment you've already made. You can't decide in the moment. 00:18:08
If you decide in the moment you're going to lose the battle, you have to have decided well in advance. 00:18:11
No matter what people say or how they say it to me, remember the public fellow governance team member and employee of the city. 00:18:15
I'm going to maintain my civility and professionalism no matter what anybody else does. 00:18:20
And then in the moment you can reinforce it. 00:18:25
Right. You can reinforce that very thing. 00:18:28
So. 00:18:31
You don't have to be, Mr. Rogers, when somebody's screaming at you, both barrels of judgment pointed at you. 00:18:31
But you absolutely can maintain your stability with a serious tone. I I don't appreciate the way you're speaking to me. I don't 00:18:38
appreciate the tone that you're using and the accusations that you're making. So I'm just going to step away, all right? 00:18:43
There's an OK tone. It's neither friendly nor unfriendly. It's just a serious tone. 00:18:50
But going back at them, we win nothing if we start to fall into these tones. So I shared that with you. There's the road map 00:18:55
talking about the public trust, leaders and leadership, the role of City Council, the council manager, form of government. Couple 00:18:59
reminders. 00:19:03
Things that you know, because I'm just going to rely on. 00:19:07
City of Port Wines Municipal Code. 00:19:10
And then, leading by example, the importance of civility and professionalism, reinforcing a couple of things. 00:19:12
Supporting and policing one another. A lot of that right can be found at the end of this document, but a lot of it comes in the 00:19:18
day-to-day support of one another and how. 00:19:22
You connect. 00:19:27
And how you can remedy things when they go wrong. 00:19:28
Some of the stuff that's going to be talking about conflict prevention. 00:19:32
Conflict resolution. 00:19:36
Positively responding to the conflict. 00:19:38
Will be in our July 25th meeting if I have that date correctly. 00:19:40
July 25th. 00:19:46
I'll confirm that later, and then some pitfalls to avoid at the end. 00:19:48
There will be pitfalls that we talk about and we may have talked in some of our meetings, not all of them. 00:19:52
Where we talk about hey. 00:19:57
When I'm out in the world. 00:19:59
I'm a council member. I'm the mayor, the mayor Pro Tem. 00:20:00
But I'm speaking as an individual, you know, isn't that OK? Don't I have the ability to do that? We'll cover some of those in the 00:20:04
pitfalls to make sure that we're not doing things in a way that could undermine the collective efforts of this great governance 00:20:10
team. So with that in mind, let's start with my favorite bits of the Brown Act. It's just one slide. This is all we're going to 00:20:15
cover in the Brown Act right here. Is this because it's almost poetic in nature? It's in the preamble. 00:20:21
Public commissions, boards, councils and other legislative bodies of local government agencies exist to aid in the conduct of the 00:20:27
people's business. 00:20:32
Don't you love that purpose? 00:20:38
That's you. 00:20:40
You exist to aid in the conduct of the people's business. 00:20:42
That people do not yield their sovereignty to the bodies that serve them. 00:20:47
The people insist on remaining informed. 00:20:51
To retain control over the legislative bodies they have created. 00:20:53
So they have entrusted you. They said, hey, this person today I'm going to vote for council member Stephen Gamma. 00:20:58
Right, the incumbent, because I believe he will help aid in the conduct of the people's business. Today I'm going to vote for 00:21:05
Council member, Mayor Pro Tem Misty Perez because I believe she will help us achieve what's best for the city. 00:21:11
They do that and they did that and here you are. 00:21:17
And that trust is well placed. 00:21:21
So long as we discharge. 00:21:23
The duties and responsibilities in a way that either builds. 00:21:25
Maintains. 00:21:29
At the very least, doesn't erode the public trust. 00:21:30
Right. And there are different ways that that can happen. 00:21:35
So. 00:21:37
The people's business. That's what you're here for. 00:21:38
And there's a number of questions we can ask to that end right to to be successful at it. 00:21:41
And when you take your ethics training every couple years, these are four pillars that I believe. 00:21:45
Summarize that whole 2 hour ethics training that we do first one when you're making a decision, am I acting in the best interest 00:21:51
of the public? 00:21:54
If that is one of the four pillars that drives your decision making, along with all the best information provided by this 00:21:59
incredible. 00:22:02
City staff that work around us here and those staff reports. 00:22:06
That is a great pillar that will keep you safe. You don't have to be experts in the law. 00:22:09
And know everything about. 00:22:13
Government Code section 1090. 00:22:15
Or Penal Code section 68 on. 00:22:17
Bribery and other such things. You don't have to know all that. 00:22:20
Is this in the best interest of the public? 00:22:24
Right. And is this. 00:22:26
Well prepared, compliant with the Brown Act, so that we can act upon it. 00:22:28
And then we move forward a second pillar that should help us. 00:22:32
Anything that looks like self interested dealing we need to avoid. 00:22:35
Anything that looks like it's going to benefit us, we need to avoid. 00:22:39
This is all about maintaining building. 00:22:42
At the very least, not eroding that public trust. 00:22:44
And there are in those trainings and. 00:22:47
With our. 00:22:50
Well heeled, great experience law firm that we have as a City Attorney's office. 00:22:51
An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. 00:22:57
And we need to really address things, vet things, and filter things. 00:23:01
Through our cities City Attorney's office, if there's even a question. 00:23:05
Of self interested conduct, self interested dealing. 00:23:08
So that we make sure that we are clearing there and that's our clearing house. 00:23:11
They are the ones who can help us. 00:23:15
If we come to them after the fact, that can be problematic. So anything by way of self-interest in dealing we should avoid. 00:23:17
Right. That's a second great pillar, third out of the four. 00:23:24
Don't abuse a position or authority. 00:23:27
And sometimes it doesn't feel like we're abusing position or authority. 00:23:29
And the rest of the public perceives it as abusing position or authority, little things. 00:23:32
Right like this. Pick an employee, not a governance team member. 00:23:38
Who shows up at A? 00:23:41
You know a formal grand opening event at a local Java Hut somewhere. 00:23:43
And. 00:23:47
You know the person who's the managers from the community. They've known each other all their lives. 00:23:48
And the person says to our our. 00:23:52
Building code compliance officer, right and whatnot. 00:23:54
Hey, well, looks like you're here. I should have expected it. You always wanna free anything? Like a free cup of coffee. Just 00:23:58
joking, Busting chops kind of thing. 00:24:02
And the employee doesn't take it that way. 00:24:05
Well, you're just lucky. I have a sense of humor, so I don't notice all the violations you have in this corridor with these boxes. 00:24:07
Blocking the fire exits. 00:24:13
May not seem like much, but it could be the appearance of abusing position or authority to other folks right to that end. 00:24:15
We have to be careful with the things we say. 00:24:23
Right, even as private citizens, right? Even as. 00:24:26
Non elected individuals with First Amendment rights. 00:24:30
We always have to be careful and and the public is counting on you for that. So act in the best interest of the public, avoid 00:24:34
self-interest to dealing, don't abuse your authority or even have that vision of it. 00:24:39
And then avoid even the appearance of impropriety the good news for you. 00:24:45
You know all this. 00:24:49
You have it already. I've gone through these 34 pages. 00:24:50
Of our policies and procedures for the Council. 00:24:54
Again amended last September and formally I think with our city clerk signature sometime in November. 00:24:57
Of last year. 00:25:03
I share with you the appearance of impropriety can help you in so many ways. 00:25:05
Years ago, when I was still in the trenches as a trial lawyer. 00:25:10
Myself and another. 00:25:13
Umm. 00:25:15
Partner at the firm. I was an associate at the time. 00:25:16
Where I'm responsible for taking anything that was born to trial to go to trial. Not everybody wants to. In most cases, don't. 00:25:19
Umm. 00:25:25
You know, upwards of 98%, somewhere in there. That number fluctuates. 00:25:26
Don't go to trial. They settle, get dismissed, whatever. 00:25:30
Well, we had to take them when they did and we enjoyed it, so. 00:25:33
And one was handed off to me where I had to represent a law firm. 00:25:36
That was being sued for malpractice. It was an insurance claim. It was a matter of expertise, but I could handle that. 00:25:39
And I went there and now one of the partners at the firm. 00:25:44
And by the way, they were just being sued because they were trying to collect 800,000 that a client owed them after a verdict, not 00:25:48
in their favor. 00:25:51
And so they didn't want to pay, and they thought they could get leveraged by. 00:25:55
By suing for malpractice, a common thing that happens. 00:25:58
So there was no actual evidence of malpractice by the firm that was supportable and in the middle of this binding arbitration. 00:26:01
Pursuant to their fee agreement, they settled. 00:26:07
And for almost the full price that the law firm was trying to collect, one of the partners had now become the presiding judge. 00:26:11
That's the Superior Court for their county. 00:26:15
And we went to lunch where 5 counties away. 00:26:19
From where they were. 00:26:21
The presiding judge. 00:26:23
And as I bought dinner. 00:26:25
And this icon in downtown San Jose called Original Joe's. 00:26:27
I was getting ready to pay the bill and she pulls out her purse and. 00:26:31
Starts to give me someone. I said no, no, no. I'll call her Lisa. No, Lisa, it's OK. I'm. I'm gonna cover it. You know, that's my 00:26:35
responsibility. 00:26:37
She says no, no, I have to pay for my own. 00:26:40
And I said we are five counties away. No one's gonna know I bought your lasagna. 00:26:43
And some cheesecake. 00:26:47
And and I felt I was a pretty moral guy saying all those things. 00:26:49
Sealing forward, you know where this is going, right? Sealing forward. And she said Jerry. 00:26:53
I don't know. 00:26:58
And boy, I felt that. 00:27:01
Chastisements, right. Professional chastisement, right there. What's that measure of character we hear so often? 00:27:02
If you have the chance to get away with somebody, no one's ever gonna find out. 00:27:09
But you do the right thing anyway, but you comply anyway. 00:27:13
That's the measure of real character. And this was I was sitting in front of her. 00:27:16
The measure of real character. She taught me a lesson that day. 00:27:20
In 19. 00:27:22
9899 That all these years later I still hold dear to the heart. 00:27:24
Because of the. 00:27:29
It cut me to the course what it did. 00:27:31
O even avoid The appearance of impropriety goes beyond that. 00:27:33
You know and and we'll talk about that a little bit more at some point given our our time. 00:27:37
But those are it if you're focused on these four pillars driving what you do and your formal capacity and those chairs. 00:27:42
Great things will happen. 00:27:48
As well as the civility and the professionalism. 00:27:50
With which you conduct yourselves individually and collectively. 00:27:53
Right, so. 00:27:58
It all boils down to this. 00:27:59
Are you truly committed to being a leader? 00:28:02
Business schools across this great nation, dare I say, across the globe. 00:28:09
Have tried in vain. 00:28:14
With the research that they're doing still today. 00:28:15
To create a universally accepted definition of what a leader is. 00:28:18
And to date one has not been created. 00:28:22
That's academically supported. 00:28:25
You know, we have a military version of leadership. 00:28:27
That gets employed. It's often top down. It's often autocratic and authoritative. 00:28:30
But even that requires more soft power than it used to, given today's military. 00:28:35
Right, there's no one way that works best. 00:28:39
There's democratic leadership. 00:28:42
Servant Leadership. 00:28:44
The list goes on of the types of leadership, affiliative leadership. 00:28:46
Et cetera. 00:28:50
And there is no single best way. 00:28:51
That we can count on, so we're not asking anyone of the five of you. 00:28:54
To align your individual paradigm with one way to lead. 00:28:57
Because that would be a mistake. 00:29:01
The people didn't vote for that. 00:29:02
But they voted for. 00:29:04
Or whatever your leadership style is. 00:29:06
We want you to be courteous, professional and civil. 00:29:08
We want you to get things done. 00:29:11
Right. We want you to get it done. 00:29:14
And that will be their measure of success for so many in positions of authority. 00:29:16
Peter Drucker uses this definition right. The only definition of a leader is someone who has followers. 00:29:20
And it's pretty simple. 00:29:25
But it's real. 00:29:27
And by this definition, all of you. 00:29:28
All of you are defined as leaders. I want to be clear about that. 00:29:31
You have people who follow you don't know if they follow you on Facebook, social media or anything else. 00:29:34
But you're here because you have followers, people who like your version. 00:29:39
Of what we want to do, and we'll follow you because of it. 00:29:43
Umm. 00:29:47
Different experiences you bring to the table. I like Mother Teresa's an awful lot. Your true character is most accurately 00:29:48
measured. 00:29:51
By how you treat those who can do nothing for you. 00:29:54
I love that. 00:29:59
Right. How do you treat people who can do nothing for you? 00:30:00
Well, I'm. 00:30:03
I have I venture to guess that we could probably fill this room. 00:30:05
With people who could give us examples of your goodness. 00:30:08
And the things you do for them. 00:30:11
Even though. 00:30:13
You may not gain anything from them, right? You someone say a vote, but there's other places to get those votes. 00:30:14
Can you do things for a neighbor? An elderly neighbor? 00:30:19
I I have this dream that I'm not gonna travel as much. 00:30:23
One day. 00:30:26
As I do now, every Monday and every Friday I'm on an airplane. 00:30:27
And then work Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday and that dream will include then. 00:30:31
Me being able to take a Thursday night or a Friday night at 3:00. 00:30:34
Of my local senior homes, skilled nursing facilities and other places. 00:30:38
To take my very musical family and entertain them. 00:30:43
Even though they can have nothing that they can give us or do for us, but I do feel like just their their warmth and their 00:30:46
reaction is giving me something. 00:30:50
I believe in this very much. And then Sam Walton. 00:30:55
Leaders must always put their people before themselves. If you do that, your business will take care of itself. 00:30:58
And in your case. 00:31:04
Your people are the people. 00:31:05
The people. 00:31:08
Right. You're about their business. 00:31:09
And if you put them first, I believe this one makes sense for us. 00:31:11
As a governance team in a public entity. 00:31:15
And so that's why I appreciate this one and why it makes sense to use a retail. 00:31:17
You know, giants not not everybody loves. 00:31:22
Because it makes so much sense in the context of. 00:31:25
Public service truly now, while there is no definition, universal definition. 00:31:28
Of what a leader is. 00:31:32
There is a universal definition of leadership. 00:31:34
There is. 00:31:38
Now I can't say because I haven't worked on every continent I've worked in the Western Hemisphere. 00:31:39
Right. I've worked in Mexico and Central America, done a little bit of consulting. 00:31:44
In South America. 00:31:48
Mostly remote stuff that we do in that regard. 00:31:51
And I will tell you. 00:31:54
That this definition crosses international boundaries, but I can't speak for the continent of Africa or. 00:31:55
Or Asia, South, Asia, et cetera. 00:32:01
But you tell me if it resonates with you. 00:32:04
The ability to provide a common or shared objective. 00:32:06
And then motivating a group to achieve that objective. 00:32:09
That is absolutely a universal definition of leadership in the world that I travel in. 00:32:14
The ability to provide a commoner shared objective than motivating a group to achieve that objective. 00:32:19
And you can do it in any context. 00:32:24
And you don't need a title to engage in leadership. 00:32:26
A kid walking down the street here. 00:32:30
Could see something like a huge branch fall off because of a windstorm. 00:32:32
See a couple of grown-ups, a couple of adults and a couple of kids. 00:32:36
And say, hey Sir, can you stop that traffic from coming? Then me and these other kids will take that branch and move it. 00:32:39
So that this won't be a hindrance to the rest of these people. That's leadership. 00:32:44
The ability to provide a common or shared objective, then motivating a group to achieve that objective. 00:32:48
That is what the people expect of you. 00:32:53
As a governance team. 00:32:56
To provide this commoner shared objective. So if someone came up to you today. 00:32:58
And, said council member Gamma, This is rhetorical, don't answer. 00:33:02
What are our objectives in the city? What are we trying to accomplish in the next 18 months? 00:33:06
Council Member Hernandez, What? Our three-year goals, our five year goals. 00:33:12
What foundation are we laying for Port Wanami 20 years from now? 00:33:16
In 2043. 00:33:20
Can we answer those questions? 00:33:22
What are the common or shared objectives? 00:33:24
You may be able to, you may not. I don't know. I don't have enough information to that effect. 00:33:26
I do know that as part of these trainings that were. 00:33:30
You know brought to you by the joint powers authority you belong to. 00:33:33
California JPA. 00:33:37
Terrific pool, by the way. 00:33:39
No connection to him. 00:33:41
Beyond being a service provider for them, but I will tell you. 00:33:43
For many years I owned a firm. 00:33:46
That ran 14 JPH. 00:33:48
We were not public entity employees, We were private staff contracted to run these 14 Jpas. 00:33:51
All over the state of California. 00:33:55
And I compare our teams, which were great. 00:33:57
To the team at at CJPIA. 00:34:00
And equally great, they have a great, great team there and a great resource to all of you to that end. 00:34:03
So. 00:34:09
Are we doing this? Where are we one of the sessions to get back to Cal JPA? 00:34:10
Is they want to support here? 00:34:14
Is to provide and it's not something that we'll do, but somebody else. 00:34:16
A strategic planning facilitator for you? 00:34:20
So that you can update right? Even if you have goals? 00:34:23
Make sure we get those up to date and do that. I don't know how long it's been. I don't know if any of these anyone on this 00:34:26
council has been involved in a strategic planning session. 00:34:30
Or if this team as a whole has, so that'll be something that's important to be able to answer these questions. 00:34:34
And so. 00:34:39
This city needs your collective leadership. 00:34:41
We we love you individually. We need you collectively more than ever. 00:34:44
And so let's just delve right into that then, this council manager form of government. 00:34:48
Relying on. 00:34:53
First, your role, right? What is your role? 00:34:54
When we look at this, that's what this next slide is all about. 00:34:57
Four parts. 00:35:00
Easy to remember. 00:35:02
You could probably share them with me, but let's start with the first one. 00:35:03
You set the direction. 00:35:07
You provide the vision. 00:35:08
For this great city. 00:35:10
What are we about? 00:35:12
If we are here to aid in the people's business. 00:35:14
What do we believe needs to happen? 00:35:18
Over the short term, the midterm, and the long term. 00:35:20
To support the people's business. 00:35:23
It may be involved, but please, Council Member again, can I request that a light up here be turned on? 00:35:29
Or. 00:35:35
Maybe a little more light? 00:35:36
Is that good or you want? Yeah. 00:35:37
Yeah. 00:35:40
Thank you. Thank you for that request. We want you all to be comfortable and be able to see everything. 00:35:41
I just requested the darker because I look better in soft lighting so. 00:35:45
So the vision, right? For some of you, that vision may be. 00:35:50
That we want facilities. 00:35:54
In the jurisdiction. 00:35:56
Of the city of Port Winema to be available to its residents. 00:35:57
Parks, beaches, whatever that is. Courts. 00:36:01
Umm. 00:36:05
Common areas for picnics and gatherings. 00:36:05
That may be a vision for what you have, and collectively you need to decide where that is on the priority. 00:36:08
Versus. 00:36:15
Infrastructure, things like what does, what do our water pipes look like that are primary providers? 00:36:16
Of our clean drinking water. 00:36:23
Right. Are we gonna start to sever some infrastructure that we know some of our larger cities to the South? 00:36:26
Have impacted them over the years, this last 10 years in particular. 00:36:31
And and created them. 00:36:35
Tremendous deficits that may not, may or may not have been planned for, depending on who you ask. 00:36:38
And all were a part of deferred maintenance. 00:36:42
Right, Because we thought we had time. 00:36:45
When these? 00:36:47
Clay, ceramic, and other such material water pipes were put in in 1908, or whenever that was. 00:36:48
So what are those goals that will give us the opportunity to say, OK, our vision is? 00:36:55
A safe. 00:36:59
Well heeled infrastructure for the city. 00:37:01
A data and then we break it down to other goals and then the city manager. 00:37:04
Takes those goals and we have a new city manager starting, so it's a great time to have this dialogue. 00:37:08
Takes those goals and ensures they understand them and you ensure they understand them. 00:37:13
And then they. 00:37:18
Delegate them to the different directors in the city. They get delegated down to managers without your vision. 00:37:20
The goals that our departments are setting. 00:37:26
Are just to the best of their ability. 00:37:30
To. 00:37:32
Deal with the day-to-day operational things of the City of Port Wanami. 00:37:33
And they're not, perhaps. 00:37:36
And I don't know them, so this isn't in any way a judgment of them. But in cities like this, where there's no overarching vision. 00:37:38
They create goals, these directors. 00:37:44
That they think. 00:37:46
Are the best. 00:37:47
For the department, for the city, et cetera. 00:37:49
And they may or may not be connected to one another. 00:37:51
We need this to be a cohesive collective, trying to move the collective needle for this city to achieve outcomes. 00:37:54
That you? 00:38:00
Envision. 00:38:02
Right. And it can only be done once we have that vision in place. So number one, set direction for the city. 00:38:03
#2 You adopt the policies and procedures that are needed. 00:38:09
To successfully. 00:38:13
Operate this city on a regular basis. 00:38:15
Right. What are the policies and procedures that set behavioral expectations? 00:38:18
That creates structure. 00:38:22
Because structure drives behavior. 00:38:23
Where there's no structure, some employees will not thrive. 00:38:26
And others might be paying on their own personal character, et cetera. But structure drives behavior. 00:38:30
And we set that structure through a number of policies that we create so. 00:38:35
Vision. 00:38:39
Policies and procedures. 00:38:39
And then you are. 00:38:41
Advocates. 00:38:43
To the world. 00:38:44
Right. So this world that we call Port Wanami. 00:38:45
And you share those with the people you encounter in your various roles and capacities. 00:38:47
At both official and unofficial. 00:38:52
Engagements that you're out there. 00:38:55
Attending. 00:38:57
Representing the city. 00:38:58
You share with people? Yeah. Here's what we're doing, here's what we're focused on. When you go to regional things and you meet 00:38:59
with other council members from other cities. 00:39:03
In the county or beyond? 00:39:06
Right. You talk and you listen to them and what will you impart? The things that you're all about? 00:39:08
And what we're trying to achieve here in the city and how and why, etc. 00:39:13
So you're the great champions? 00:39:16
Every goal needs champions. 00:39:19
And you were the great champions of those goals to folks that will listen. 00:39:21
And and those folks are typically members of the community and other stakeholders, typically not the employees themselves, but 00:39:25
everybody else. Yes, those goals should be shared through their leadership chain. 00:39:30
From city manager to director to Manager, supervisor, then the employees themselves and lastly. 00:39:35
And this is your role right on this leadership that we need you hire a city manager. 00:39:42
That is one of your primary objectives, those four. 00:39:47
Pillar things that you need to do, attract and retain. 00:39:51
And and performance manage a city manager. 00:39:54
Well, here we are, right. You've just done that and we do that periodically. 00:39:57
And so we've hired a city manager who we believe possesses through our vetting process. 00:40:02
We believe possesses the skills. 00:40:07
Abilities, experience and know how. 00:40:09
They are a subject matter expert in the governance. 00:40:13
Of local governments, municipalities in particular. And now that you have them, your job is to ensure that they are doing the 00:40:16
things. 00:40:19
That they said they were gonna do and that you want them to do. 00:40:23
Because that's the one employee you do get to supervise and manage. 00:40:27
Is the city manager any questions about those four areas of vision policies? 00:40:30
Communication, right? Being the Champions or the hiring of a city manager? 00:40:36
Please, I think the choice of. 00:40:42
Avoiding here, it's interesting that you use the word shepherd. 00:40:45
That the city manager should shepherd the council's vision. Can you elaborate on what you mean by shepherd? 00:40:49
Yeah, you know. 00:40:56
It is a form of leadership and may be evidence of one that I like. 00:40:58
You can only be a shepherd leader if you have competent people around you. 00:41:02
Right. And what does the shepherd do? A shepherd sometime walks behind. 00:41:06
And when I think of a sheep shepherd, right, and and one of the sheep starts to wander off, you know, and wander off. 00:41:09
They get them back in, they jump in and bring them back into the fold, if you will, that kind of thing. Some shepherds are in 00:41:16
front. 00:41:19
In March. 00:41:23
This is still true in March. 00:41:24
I had an occasion to to visit the Middle East. 00:41:27
And I was in Israel. 00:41:30
And in Turkey? 00:41:31
And while I was there. 00:41:33
We we went with this. 00:41:35
Individual who we had hired and took us out because I wanted to see the Shepherd leadership at work. 00:41:37
And sure enough, they had corralled. 00:41:41
Couldn't be less than 500 sheep into the safeguard. 00:41:45
Natural demographics around. 00:41:48
And then a gates made out of wood. 00:41:50
Like an Old West kind of gate, you know what I mean? Just raw, raw fencing. 00:41:54
And that's for protection. And the shepherds align themselves around the outside at night. Some they had one or two dogs, but 00:41:57
mostly it was human work. 00:42:00
And in the morning they opened the gate. 00:42:04
And once Shepherd calls. 00:42:07
And his sheep. 00:42:08
Know his voice, and they follow him. 00:42:10
And then the next shepherd and the next. And it's amazing how that unfolds. Some shepherds I noticed are out front. 00:42:13
Summer up and back and they're doing this right, bringing them back into the safety of of the. 00:42:18
Flock. 00:42:24
And so for me, a city manager. 00:42:26
If he or she is fortunate enough to have a capable workforce. 00:42:28
Working, for example, in the city of Port Wanami. 00:42:32
All he or she has to do. 00:42:35
Is give that vision. 00:42:37
Taken from you to those directors. 00:42:38
And ensure that those directors. 00:42:41
Are communicating. 00:42:43
And managing. 00:42:45
The outcomes of their responsibility to achieve the vision that you have set. 00:42:47
And they ship her debt by. 00:42:53
Pretty much leaving them alone until they need to go there and speak. 00:42:54
And do or take action. 00:42:59
And if you have a director, who for example? 00:43:00
Is more of a placeholder than a leader. 00:43:03
They're in their final years of those peers, handcuffs. 00:43:05
And. 00:43:08
They're not really doing much. Let's just say an example. Of course I'm thinking of an entirely other city than this one. 00:43:09
And. 00:43:15
Then the city manager has to get in to say, hey, this is not OK, you need to do more. These are the things that you were lacking 00:43:16
with specifics, right? 00:43:19
And I need to see this from you. Let's check in and. 00:43:23
30 days and see where you're at with this. 00:43:26
To me that is the shepherding part when the performance isn't happening. 00:43:28
They are guiding that performance. 00:43:32
They are leading that performance and they're holding it accountable. 00:43:34
And the accountability can be absolutely positive, as positive as it can be, but it has to has consequences. 00:43:37
Has to have consequences. 00:43:42
In order for it to be effective because structure drives behavior. 00:43:45
Systems thinking. That's how it works, right? 00:43:49
So that's what I mean by shepherding that they they need to be constantly vigilant. 00:43:51
Because they have to report back to you. 00:43:55
Right. And if there's elements to it and our mayor has a question, Council Member Gamma has a question, why haven't we achieved 00:43:58
this or why haven't we achieved that? 00:44:02
And the answers need to be readily available. 00:44:07
Lack of resources? Ohh well we had the tornado that came through. 00:44:10
And it set us back, you know, three months. 00:44:14
There have to be answers to those questions. 00:44:17
And if they're not, then you know you have to ask why don't we have answers? 00:44:20
Does our leader not have their finger on the pulse of what's happening? 00:44:24
Right. And then we could also ask as we police each other. 00:44:27
Well, Mr. Mayor, I appreciate your question, but as I'm listening to the. 00:44:31
City manager. 00:44:35
It seems like that information would not be available to anybody, so I'm not sure how reasonable the request is. 00:44:36
And you? 00:44:41
Police each other on the idea of whether or not we're making unreasonable demands on our leaders. 00:44:42
Right. So that's an important part of this, of what you do. So that was my long answer. Thank you, Council member to that 00:44:47
question. 00:44:51
Any other comments or questions? I don't want to be questions, they can be comments. 00:44:54
Are you comfortable with this some? 00:44:58
If you disagree with any of its. 00:45:00
Is it consistent with what you learned when you went to the League of California Cities? 00:45:02
Right. And they're training. 00:45:07
It's better. 00:45:09
That's better than what? 00:45:10
We got it. The league, I think. Good, good, good, good. All right. See. Nothing. Let's continue to press on. 00:45:12
And and I will take a break by the way, right at the one hour mark what what is, what was our agenda on how much time we allowed 00:45:16
it for this meeting? 00:45:19
2:00 o'clock two hours, right? 00:45:23
Alright, so I'll take a break right into one hour, right? 00:45:25
So right at 4:00 o'clock. 00:45:29
I will take a break. 00:45:30
So. 00:45:32
When you give that direction. 00:45:34
Please remember, stay in your lane, right, in a positive way, council member comma. You have a different number. 00:45:35
Is it 4:30 or? 00:45:42
No, that's for the next meeting. 00:45:44
So. 00:45:49
Well, I going till five, right? Yeah, we'll go till 5. 00:45:50
OK. 00:45:52
OK. 00:45:53
For the next meeting. 00:45:57
Very good. 00:45:58
A little more likely. 00:46:02
Maybe, Anna, it's maybe the. 00:46:04
That's. 00:46:08
Yeah, that's nice. I can see you all even better now. 00:46:09
So since we know those are our roles and and truly. 00:46:13
You know when, when we elected you right, We the people. 00:46:16
That's our expectation of you. 00:46:20
Some people may have other expectations of you. 00:46:22
They may say right as they come to you, hey, I voted for you, I campaigned for you. My whole neighborhood got you a majority of 00:46:26
the voters, You know, because what we did. 00:46:30
So what are you going to do about this tree? 00:46:35
Right. 00:46:38
And they may come to you with those questions. 00:46:39
And I think those are fair requests as far as in their mind goes or their collective paradigm. 00:46:41
But if it doesn't fit. 00:46:46
Within what we just described. 00:46:49
Of setting a vision. 00:46:51
Right setting, adopting policies and procedures. 00:46:53
Being champions and communicating what these things are. 00:46:56
And then working through our city manager who we hired will hopefully will retain and will be great for us. 00:46:59
Then we don't do it. We say, hey, I appreciate what you're saying. 00:47:04
I can see why that would be a concern to you. 00:47:07
I will talk to our city manager and let him know. 00:47:09
About this concern. 00:47:12
And. 00:47:14
Hopefully that will go through the process and they'll let you know what can or can't be done. 00:47:15
That's it. That's what we do, right? To stay in our lane, if you will. Why? Because there's immunities that we're talking about 00:47:19
here. When you stay in your lane, there are protections. 00:47:23
And and if you want great detail on those, just talk to your city attorneys office and and have them talk to you. 00:47:29
About those things further, what we'll cover is just a little bit here on those immunities in a little bit as well. 00:47:35
But those four areas have to be our driving force. 00:47:41
As we now pivot over to. 00:47:44
What our council manager role looks like and what we do so relying on the great municipal code of Port Wanami, not going to spend 00:47:46
a lot of time. 00:47:49
I'm just going to summarize some of these and and not read them, but a couple I will read. 00:47:53
So you created the office of City Manager, if not you, then your predecessors with this municipal code that we have. 00:47:58
And and one of the things that I read that I liked, I don't see it in everyone. There's a lot of, you know. 00:48:03
There's a model, sort of municipal code out in the world that a lot of people rely on. 00:48:08
In California, and I will tell you that not all of them say. 00:48:13
Appointed by the Council solely on the basis of merits. 00:48:17
I like that. 00:48:21
I like that statement because I've always felt. 00:48:22
I just want to be the master of my own destiny. 00:48:25
And I don't want any artificial obstacles there, and I don't want any nepotism or favoritism getting in the way either. 00:48:27
And so solely on the basis of merit, I like that very much. 00:48:33
This one tells us. 00:48:36
That the city manager is the leader of the administration of the day-to-day operation of the city. 00:48:38
As it says on the last, second, last line, efficient administration of all. 00:48:46
Of city affairs under his control. 00:48:50
Right, and here's how he does it. Or she does it, depending on who our city manager is. 00:48:52
The top ones just telling us. 00:48:57
They prepare a budget. 00:48:59
And they monitor the budget and they report to you on the budget. 00:49:00
You can expect that of your city manager based on your code. 00:49:03
They keep you fully apprised to the financial conditions of the city. 00:49:06
Big part of it. 00:49:10
Your municipal code that you develop says, yeah, we're gonna do that. 00:49:11
And by the way, we want you to prepare periodic financial reports for us and that office does that, the office of City manager. 00:49:15
On this one. 00:49:21
It's talking to us a lot about. 00:49:22
Umm. 00:49:24
There are procedures and policies at times that need to be developed in order to administer the business of the city. No better 00:49:25
example of that than 2020-2021. 00:49:31
And 2022 with our worldwide pandemic. 00:49:36
So many of my client cities. 00:49:40
Umm. 00:49:43
Had to develop hybrid work policies right or full remote work policies. 00:49:44
And some of them work so well. 00:49:50
One of my public agencies. 00:49:52
Still has. 00:49:54
A remote policy where people only come to the organization. 00:49:56
Once, Maybe twice a week, tops. 00:50:00
And they're still all working remotely because they've been so productive. Now they're not a city. It would be different if you're 00:50:02
a city. How do you do public works remotely, right? How do you do public safety remotely? 00:50:07
There are regional agency that serves all nine counties of the Bay Area. 00:50:11
And so there's they're able to do it and they're doing a great job with it. So they the manager does that, our city manager who we 00:50:16
hire retain. 00:50:19
Formulates policies and rules and regulations, etcetera. They're going to attend council meetings. 00:50:23
Right. They attend council meetings. 00:50:28
And when I said the earlier one about. 00:50:30
Prepare administrative rules and regulations necessary or expedient. 00:50:34
That doesn't mean they can create legislation. 00:50:39
Or policies or procedures, right? That's your job. That was clearly the second pillar for you. 00:50:42
And they do that but exigent circumstances. 00:50:48
They have authority to do certain things. 00:50:50
And they're they're your PR person. 00:50:53
You wanted to be good at that because there are a big part of that. They ensure that. 00:50:55
All the paperwork that needs to be done for people to conduct business in the city within the rules you created for the city. 00:51:01
Are accomplished and if not, there have to be consequences, right? And if changes need to be made because of exigent 00:51:06
circumstances, you expect them. 00:51:09
To be competent and capable to do that. 00:51:13
And then they appoint people. 00:51:16
Hopefully qualified, capable. 00:51:17
Based on their merit, kind of people to do the people's business here in the city. 00:51:19
They dismiss, suspend, remove all those things on there. 00:51:24
Letter H sub Part H. 00:51:28
Employees in the city within. 00:51:31
The bounds of the law. 00:51:33
Right, whatever law applies. 00:51:34
And they sometimes employ temporary part time people as needed. 00:51:36
Going through a couple of these. 00:51:39
They bottom when they devote his or her entire time to the duties of his or her office. 00:51:41
And to the interests of the city. 00:51:45
Or we need that? 00:51:48
In the city manager. 00:51:49
I've never met a city manager who could have one foot on the dock and 1 foot on the boat. 00:51:50
And be really successful at it. 00:51:55
You know they're gonna get wet if they try to do that. 00:51:57
So I think that's an important one. I'm glad you have it in your. 00:52:00
Municipal code describing the duties of that city manager. 00:52:04
And perform other duties as you require of them and within their power. 00:52:07
Procure things that need to be procured within the policies. 00:52:11
That you've adopted and created consistent with those things. 00:52:15
And always keep it in mind, being fiscally sound. 00:52:18
And can. 00:52:21
Having that budget in mind. 00:52:22
Recommend. Here's where it comes back to you. Recommend ordinances and resolutions. 00:52:25
To the Council for adoption. 00:52:29
One of your primary roles. 00:52:31
Right that that the the city manager deems necessary or expedient. 00:52:33
Does that mean you have to adopt those things? 00:52:38
Does the city manager come to you and say, hey, you need to adopt this? 00:52:41
They might, but I don't know how effective they would be and how long they would last if they were dictating to you. 00:52:44
I do know city managers that wield a great deal of power. 00:52:50
And have been around their cities a long time. 00:52:53
And because of their track record of excellence. 00:52:55
They are deferred to quite a bit in that city. 00:52:58
But there's no guarantee, because you. 00:53:01
Are the shepherds the check and balance of the city's business here when it comes to ensuring? 00:53:04
Is this in the best interest of the city? 00:53:08
Right. Is this in the best interest of the people? That's your role? 00:53:11
And so you have to maintain that one, take that one very seriously. 00:53:15
Right. 00:53:18
We want to make sure our city manager also knows that if there's something going on here. 00:53:19
That somehow impeding our ability to effectively discharge the work of the city. 00:53:23
They're on top of it and they report back to us and we say. 00:53:27
Hey, what's this? Hold up. 00:53:30
How come we haven't had any permit signed in? 00:53:31
The last three months, what is the problem? Whatever it is, right, we expect them to be able to answer those questions for us. 00:53:34
With facts and data. 00:53:39
And do those things. 00:53:40
So there's a lot we expect of these city managers exercise general supervision. 00:53:42
Over all of our structures. 00:53:47
And ensure they're properly maintained, right? And a good facilities crew, et cetera. 00:53:48
Capital improvement projects, we expect them to be on top of those as we. 00:53:54
And charge them if one of our pillars one of our visions. 00:53:58
The pillar of creating a vision is, hey, we want to get on in 2324, we want to be right on top of. 00:54:01
The deferred maintenance of our City Hall. 00:54:09
Right Then you expect him? 00:54:12
To formulate a great deal of those capital improvement projects, along with building, planning, community development, whoever 00:54:14
that is, and to shepherd those things through. 00:54:18
And report back to you on a consistent basis, those types of things. 00:54:22
Cooperate with community organizations. 00:54:26
We hope they're never at odds with any stakeholders in Port Wanami. 00:54:28
Umm. 00:54:32
This is always one that I wonder how people feel when I bring that one up. 00:54:32
People haven't written in different ways. Under your subpart S, it says receive an open all mail address to the council. 00:54:37
And give immediate attention thereto. 00:54:43
So that all the administrative business referred to and said communications. 00:54:46
Not necessarily requiring Council manic. Like that word, action may be disposed of between council meetings. 00:54:50
So just a quick question. 00:54:56
Is it our city clerk that opens that mail? 00:54:58
Right. And that's what's necessary for it in filtering that. 00:55:00
Still. 00:55:05
Right. We have to have that responsibility to be maintained and and. 00:55:05
The City manager ensuring that our wonderful City clerk is discharging that duty and responsibility. 00:55:09
So this one's a little bit bigger. I put it on one slide. Neither the council nor any member thereof shall give orders to any 00:55:14
subordinates of the city manager. 00:55:19
That means. 00:55:24
Anybody below below the city manager, whether it's director, manager. 00:55:25
Non supervisory employee. 00:55:29
Patrol officer, Sergeant, you name it. 00:55:31
The city manager shall take instructions from the council. 00:55:34
Only when sitting in a duly held meeting of the Council. 00:55:37
That's your municipal code. 00:55:42
Right. 00:55:44
How are we doing this? Is rhetorical. 00:55:45
Or you can comment if you want but. 00:55:47
It's rhetorical. 00:55:49
Going back to focusing on ourselves. 00:55:50
Am I part of the problem or part of the solution? 00:55:54
City manager shall take instructions from the council only when sitting in a duly held meeting of the council. 00:55:57
Do we? 00:56:03
Expect our city manager when we speak to them. 00:56:04
To take what we say. 00:56:07
As direction. 00:56:09
Right, there's the question. 00:56:12
And the the thing I'd like to point out to you is. 00:56:14
As a member of this governance team, what you may think? 00:56:17
Is regular conversation. 00:56:21
When you pop into the city manager's office. 00:56:24
May feel like more than that to the person on the receiving end. 00:56:27
You may just say, hey, I noticed that they really. 00:56:32
Cut back. 00:56:35
Those crape Myrtle trees more than normal, they look like stumps. 00:56:37
Not like cut back crape myrtles over on Maple Ave. 00:56:41
You know, and it's just shocking to see. I wonder if they've made a mistake. 00:56:44
You're just making an observation. 00:56:49
How might that be heard by a city manager? 00:56:52
I'm going to go talk to Public Works, my director. 00:56:55
And see what that's about. 00:56:57
And so I see created action. 00:56:59
City manager has a lot of action they need to deal with and a lot on their plate. 00:57:01
And the city manager shall take instructions. 00:57:06
From the Council only when sitting in a duly held meeting of the Council. 00:57:08
Because the governance team. 00:57:12
Gives the city manager. 00:57:15
Instruction, action, etc. Not one individual council member. 00:57:16
That is a tough line for most of my. 00:57:21
You know. 00:57:25
Governance team city councils. 00:57:26
To manage, that's a tough line for many on those teams to manage. For context, we have hundreds of public entity clients. 00:57:28
Right, We do. And that's a tough line to manage. 00:57:36
Do you have any questions, concerns, clarification, or anything else that you want on this particular subject? 00:57:38
It was written, but I am in complete agreement. I did just come back. 00:57:52
From a JPI train. OK and so this is. 00:57:57
A lot more in depth. 00:58:02
But point on. 00:58:04
What? What I came back with? 00:58:06
And so I think, I think for us. 00:58:08
What is in my mind right now? 00:58:13
Is um. 00:58:16
As a. 00:58:18
Team which we are governance team. 00:58:19
That I feel that. 00:58:22
I want to believe that, my colleagues. 00:58:24
Are open to holding. 00:58:29
Each of us accountable. 00:58:31
When we. 00:58:33
See things that are outside of our own governance documents specifically. 00:58:35
But just. 00:58:40
The the responsibility. 00:58:42
Of the Council. So I appreciate you making this one comment because even sometimes. 00:58:44
Things come up and I say like ohh, I'm part of the team. I didn't even know about that or. 00:58:52
How are we even talking about this right now? Someone else will say something and I'll say. 00:58:57
Really. 00:59:00
And I'm like, am I supposed to know that too or you know? So I think that we have a lot of work to do as it relates to being a 00:59:01
governance team. 00:59:05
And that at some point we we really have to get into just really holding each other responsible and not being afraid to say things 00:59:09
that might make people uncomfortable. I'm in the same line as you are. I think that you could say pretty much anything you want to 00:59:15
say and you can be professional about it. 00:59:21
And so I would really like to get there, but I would really like to get to the point to where if I'm. 00:59:27
If I'm seeing something that I feel safe that I can call it out. 00:59:32
And that my, the other council members will do the same, I think, because if we don't get there then we'll continue to have the 00:59:37
same issues that we. 00:59:41
We we have. 00:59:45
If we don't get to the point to where we can, we can. We can. And when I say call each other out, I don't mean to be aggressive. I 00:59:46
just mean to speak up and say, ohh, I thought that was outside of our roles and responsibilities or oh, I thought that was the 00:59:52
city manager's role. Absolutely. Things like that. Yeah. And it would look like this just for a moment, I'm going to elevate 00:59:57
myself to a council member. Right, Say. 01:00:03
Ohh. 01:00:08
Council member McQueen Lejohn. Did I say your last? OK, I appreciate what you're saying there. I really do. 01:00:09
I don't know if you noticed, but the way you framed it or when that next meeting could happen. 01:00:17
It would exclude me. 01:00:21
I don't think you intended that right? And so I did. Couldn't help but feel left out of that. Or like my voice maybe didn't matter 01:00:22
as much, but. 01:00:26
Can we pick a different time? 01:00:31
Right. As opposed to me doing it this way. 01:00:33
That was a very obvious microaggression, Martha. 01:00:36
And right. And so there are ways to say things that are professional, that are courteous and are civil. 01:00:39
And. 01:00:46
We want that so bad. 01:00:48
We the people. 01:00:50
As a non elected person, not from Port Wanami, but I'm telling you. 01:00:52
We want that. 01:00:56
We do. 01:00:58
You don't need to be. 01:00:59
A jerk. 01:01:01
To get a point across or to look tough, you just don't. 01:01:03
You don't need to be aggressive or the aggressor to do that to look strong, tough, capable, like you really care about this. 01:01:07
You can do it by virtue of your regular attendance. 01:01:15
Your commitment to your preparation in advance of our Council meetings. 01:01:18
Your commitment to understanding the issues. 01:01:21
And not asking questions that are. 01:01:24
Parents and obvious that you haven't looked at the staff reports. 01:01:27
Right, et cetera. That's how we look like we are truly committed. 01:01:30
To our role as public servants and part of this great governance team of Portland, Amy. 01:01:34
This is the most time I've ever spent. 01:01:39
In the city of Port Wanami. 01:01:42
My meetings with you being the 1st. 01:01:44
And now and then continuing to come back and work with you and having the pleasure and privilege of doing so. 01:01:46
And. 01:01:51
As I drive around your city because. 01:01:52
I don't know. I kind of consider myself sort of a casual subject matter expert as I drive around all my cities that I work with. 01:01:55
There are a lot of things to like about this city. 01:02:04
And there are a lot of things. 01:02:07
You know that I see. And I said Ohh, that's what council member so and so was talking about. Ohh. That's what the mayor mentioned, 01:02:09
right. This is in my one-on-one dialogues with you. 01:02:13
And I see them. 01:02:17
You know and I think. 01:02:19
This city has so much potential. 01:02:21
You won't see it, right? It's already great as it is. I hate the idea of me suggesting like it's a meeting, a significant other. 01:02:24
Hey, I really like you. You've got a lot of potential. I can turn you into something. That's not what I mean, right? That's not 01:02:28
what I mean. What I mean is. 01:02:33
There's no reason this governance team can't be the best governance team in the history of the city of Port Miami. 01:02:39
If we're willing to look inward and say to ourselves. 01:02:45
How can I do this and be a part of this in a way? 01:02:47
That is consistent with the trust the public has. 01:02:50
And provided you with. 01:02:54
And entrusted me with to that end. 01:02:55
So this is a big one, right? 01:02:58
Watch what you say. You know and and I'm not speaking to anyone of you, I'm speaking to all five of you. 01:03:01
Watch what you say when you are meeting with our city manager. 01:03:06
If if you happen because of our city manager's absence or different things going on. 01:03:11
Our assistant city manager or whomever, That would be right. 01:03:15
Watch what you say, how you say it, to whom you're saying it, who's present when it's being said. 01:03:19
Because it may not sound like an action item to you. 01:03:24
But it's being heard as one. 01:03:27
More often than not, yes, Councilman. 01:03:28
So. 01:03:31
Mr. Preciado, can you take the example that you gave us about the City Council member going into the city manager's office and? 01:03:32
Complaining or just noting? 01:03:41
Problems with the tree. What should have happened? What would ideally? 01:03:43
How should have that gone? 01:03:47
Would the city manager have to say, you know you need to bring this up at council and then just the council member come to 01:03:49
council? 01:03:52
And bring it up and then go through an approval process. 01:03:56
Ideally, what would be the? 01:03:59
Optimal way of. 01:04:01
Addressing once? Yeah. Concern. 01:04:03
Yeah, that's a good question and and. 01:04:05
And rely on the city attorney to. 01:04:07
Get me back on track and shepherd me and if I run afoul of this one. 01:04:10
But there is an obligation in these. I meant what I said when I said I did read them. 01:04:15
Read him a couple of Times Now. 01:04:20
That says you know when your mail comes. 01:04:21
Our city manager slash, our city clerk, is going to review that. 01:04:23
And provide you with any information that's needed, otherwise process it the way they would. 01:04:27
And you each. 01:04:31
Have an obligation. 01:04:33
That if you get mail from a member of the public related to a matter of public concern, et cetera. 01:04:34
That you're supposed to give that to to our City Clerk for processing as well. 01:04:40
That's what it says in here, right? 01:04:44
And because it's a matter of public record, it's a matter of. 01:04:47
You know, is it? 01:04:51
Discoverable as the PR a public records act, right? That kind of thing. 01:04:52
So. 01:04:57
Kevin, do you want to chime in on that right as we're talking about public records as well as records retention. I believe the 01:04:58
City of San Jose case made very clear that even records received by council members on their personal cell phones or their 01:05:03
personal e-mail addresses. 01:05:07
So long as they relate to items of city, business need to be preserved and or turned over. 01:05:12
In the event about public records, act request which they are responsive. 01:05:19
In addition, one of the things that's that's off cited in our records retention schedules but not. 01:05:22
Very well talked about as government code section 34090. 01:05:27
Which essentially requires that any record document needs to be retained for a minimum period of two years. 01:05:32
So that would theoretically include. 01:05:39
Text messages. 01:05:42
Emails things of that nature and if a Public Records Act request does come in and those items are not preserved. 01:05:44
There's some potential liability there. 01:05:51
Thank you. That's exactly what I was looking for, Council member Davis. So I was the target of A. 01:05:53
Nasty gram that was sent to. 01:05:59
For my colleagues and not myself. 01:06:01
So what you're saying is, is that? 01:06:04
That should be shared with me. 01:06:06
No, it should be shared and processed through our City Clerk. 01:06:09
And then she would follow whatever process we follow. 01:06:12
In the context of correspondence like that so, but again I want to be clear. 01:06:15
Somebody sends a letter and it says Steven Gomez is the worst person. Yeah, for this assignment. 01:06:19
And and sends it to everyone but me. 01:06:25
Should not be made aware of that. 01:06:28
If it's gonna be discussed in a meeting, is that our policy in the city that when you get a mail, mail like that referring to a 01:06:30
council member who didn't receive it? 01:06:34
Is it our policy that then we make that Council Member aware? 01:06:40
Because we follow whatever our policies say. 01:06:44
I haven't personally received a such a notice or complaint or letter, but normally what I do do is when I get something, all 01:06:48
council is made aware. 01:06:53
It's like what it's provided to one, it's provided to all. 01:06:59
That is typically the answer. Council member, Yeah, well, but I think what he's referring to is it was only sent to council. It 01:07:02
was not sent to anybody else. 01:07:06
And so, going back to what our city attorney said, then council should have provided that to our records keeper. 01:07:09
Our city clerk, who then would have made it available to all who had not, and that would be you should have gone to you. Yeah, 01:07:16
right. And it should be. 01:07:19
Across the board I mean if information and I think that's been a problem that. 01:07:23
We had previously as a sharing of information. 01:07:27
You know, like if I. 01:07:32
Said Hey, a tree just fell over. 01:07:34
That I. 01:07:38
Observed on a 10:00 o'clock at night walk. 01:07:39
And I do the go Gov. 01:07:42
To to. 01:07:45
Make the city aware of it. I don't expect that to be shared with all the other council members. 01:07:46
Is that correct? 01:07:51
What does the Gogov do? Is that part of our website alerts? It's a way to report issues. 01:07:54
Graffiti, like graffiti, is a great example. Here I see it, I take a picture, I send it in. 01:07:59
And we move on. 01:08:05
Yeah, but that's quite different than. 01:08:06
Somebody, yeah, because that's a communication from you, not somebody else, to a council member like you or any of the others. 01:08:09
And if you're sharing that communication, it's not clear that. 01:08:17
What one of you shares? 01:08:20
In your observations about the city needs to go to everybody else. That part's not clear to me. 01:08:22
And I I think it's important here to highlight the implications of the Brown Act where a quorum may not discuss or deliberate or 01:08:26
take action on any item of business within the subject matter jurisdiction of the city, certainly if if an item of. 01:08:34
Public significance gets sent to 1 member of the Council. 01:08:42
Then each of the other members should. 01:08:46
Be free to access it and it should be provided to everyone on the Council equally. 01:08:48
The problem then lies in. 01:08:53
There can't be deliberation. 01:08:55
Not unless it's agendized for a duly organized public meeting where the public has an opportunity to comment as well. 01:08:57
And that's assuming it's within the subject matter jurisdiction of the city. 01:09:03
So when? 01:09:07
So. 01:09:08
So if a letter is sent to four council members. 01:09:09
On a. 01:09:14
Targeted subject manner. 01:09:15
And the other council members not. 01:09:18
Provided that information, and then there's a discussion of it. That letter in a deliberation on the on the dyess. 01:09:20
You know that. 01:09:28
That's. 01:09:29
Unfortunate, I think. I think, but again it. 01:09:30
That shouldn't happen, in fact, what you're saying, Well, not if it's of correspondence the way we just described it, if it if it, 01:09:34
you know, checks these boxes. 01:09:37
Then at some point you should have been provided with that information. Matter of public interest from members of the public to 01:09:42
the. 01:09:45
Other council members, you know that information needs to be shared and we don't always remember that one. Why it's good to have 01:09:49
meetings like these. 01:09:52
To remember that when that letter comes, whether it's about, hey, we have this barking dog issue in my trailer park on the east 01:09:55
side of town. 01:09:58
You know, stuff like that, we turn it over and then it gets disseminated as appropriate. So she had her hand up first and then 01:10:02
we'll go to our. 01:10:05
Mayor Pro Tem. 01:10:08
And I'm. 01:10:11
Pain. 01:10:12
But. 01:10:13
The letter he's talking about. 01:10:16
I received it. I didn't know anybody else received it. I thought the person had sent it to me personally. 01:10:18
And so I was like ohh OK and I didn't respond to it. 01:10:24
And then not until we got on the day as that, I realized everybody had gotten it except him. So it wasn't. I don't think it was at 01:10:27
anyone. Anyone knew that everybody else got it. 01:10:32
I thought it was just sent to me personally. 01:10:38
And then on the day as I, I realized it had been sent to everyone else. 01:10:40
Understood. Yeah, understood. So that I just wanted to say that so. 01:10:44
Steven understands. It didn't go to everyone and everybody wasn't on the distribution list. 01:10:49
Madam Mayor Pro Tem. 01:10:54
This also includes tech messages, so if we get a text message about something. 01:10:56
A community member complaining about something. 01:11:01
Then how are we supposed to handle? 01:11:04
Like that. 01:11:06
This is one of those unresolved issues of the city of San Jose, Case and I I've seen a number of cities take the position that. 01:11:08
Text messages and even certain cities, have made the argument that emails are not documents within the meaning of the government 01:11:17
code. In fact, they are transitory communications more similar to a post it note. 01:11:23
I am unaware of any legal authority that that bolsters that, but certainly the government code cannot be read to. 01:11:29
Require us to keep for a period of two years every post it note we scribble on. 01:11:37
Such such a result would be absurd. Unfortunately, the best answer that I can give you is that the law is very, very slow to 01:11:42
change and adapt to new technologies. 01:11:47
My advice would be. 01:11:53
That text messages and things of that nature, if they don't need to be deleted for I'm going to go into electronically stored 01:11:55
information discovery procedures if they don't need to be deleted as a result of routine operations of systems. 01:12:02
I would recommend retaining them because they might be discoverable in the future. 01:12:08
And an adverse inference instruction in a jury proceeding. 01:12:13
Or a charge that we've failed to comply with Government Code section 34090. 01:12:16
Certainly exposes the city to liability. That being said, there may be an argument in the event we ever find ourselves there that 01:12:21
these are in fact transitory, but I would err on the side of safety. 01:12:26
Given the unsettled nature of law. 01:12:32
I'm glad we're talking about this, because clearly you're all interested. Clearly you want to be reminded. You want to know where 01:12:34
the. 01:12:37
Boundaries are etcetera. So it's a good thing and I'm glad we have our city attorney here. 01:12:39
To assist us in in some of that. 01:12:43
Even though did you hear all that legal jargon in there? Ohh my gosh right. As a recovering lawyer for the last 20 years, not 01:12:46
going to lie gives me a little bit of chills to see how impressive that is. 01:12:51
But but the reality is. 01:12:56
Umm. 01:12:58
A lot of this is just going to be, hey, you know what, When in doubt. 01:12:59
Check. 01:13:03
Just check. 01:13:04
Right. Hey, is this something I need to turn over? If not, I'll just leave it as is. I won't delete it. 01:13:05
Just leave it at is and. 01:13:09
Hopefully no adverse rulings in the future for evidentiary purposes, right? 01:13:10
OK, so. 01:13:15
Umm. 01:13:16
When when it comes right down to it, be mindful. Ohh, good time to stop. We've been sitting. You been sitting there for an hour 01:13:17
and 11 minutes at least. 01:13:20
I think we started a little early. 01:13:23
Take a quick break, right, Come back and what about 5-5 minutes? Enough. 01:13:24
Please do. 01:13:31
Couple of slides, but this whole slide deck I'll certainly make available well. 01:19:47
I think our City clerk has a slide deck right on your laptop there. Now, yes, can be made available to any of you that want to 01:19:51
slide deck. 01:19:54
There are immunities because we want to encourage. 01:19:58
Citizens to engage. 01:20:02
And not have sort of any chilling impact or concern for liability. 01:20:05
We created governmental immunities that provide that. 01:20:08
Provided you maintain your role within that governance team that you're on. 01:20:12
They will continue to work in your favor. 01:20:17
And specifically, for example, as Government Code section 820.9. 01:20:19
Members of city councils, mayors, members of boards of supervisors. 01:20:24
Members of school boards, Members of governing boards of other local public entities. 01:20:28
Members of locally appointed boards, your commissions, etcetera. 01:20:33
Locally appointed or elected advisory boards bodies are by are not vicariously liable for injuries caused. 01:20:36
By the act or omission of the public entity or Advisory Board. 01:20:43
That is a nice thing to have. 01:20:48
Right. Anything like that would be marvelous in anyone's life. 01:20:50
Right. That exists out in the world, so we want to encourage you to participate, so. 01:20:54
If something were to happen, and again I rely on our city attorney to. 01:20:58
Correct any misinterpretation I gave you, but. 01:21:02
If you pass an ordinance or you pass. 01:21:04
You know, measure whatever thing you would be doing. 01:21:07
Legislating as an official member of this governance team. 01:21:10
If somehow that created. 01:21:13
You know, a a situation where somebody in some form was injured or presented a claim to the city. 01:21:16
You cannot be held individually liable provided you are within the bounds of this particular immunity. Does that sound generally 01:21:21
right? 01:21:25
I'm getting a a shaky nod, but there it is. OK, You had your hand up, Mr. Well, you answered my question. OK, OK. 01:21:29
So, but I do have to give you this caveat on this next slide which is. 01:21:35
Nothing in this section exonerates an official from liability for injury caused by that individual's own wrongful conduct. 01:21:39
Right, So it's not like blanket immunity, right? Nothing in this section affects the immunity of any other public official. 01:21:47
So if on an individual basis. 01:21:54
You accessed information that you are not Privy to. Like you know, in the great state of California we have an express. 01:21:57
Right of privacy. 01:22:03
I believe it's under Article One of our Constitution, whereas you know in the United States Constitution it's implied multiple 01:22:05
places, but the right of privacy is implied. 01:22:09
That's sacred here, right? And for example, medical records, we don't don't even put them when we when we receive them. 01:22:14
For a variety of reasons, we don't, when we have in our possession, put them in the regular. 01:22:21
The day-to-day personnel file of the individual, we put them in a separate place for greater security, greater privacy protection. 01:22:26
If one of you happened to access electronic records of an individual. 01:22:33
Learn about information you otherwise should not be able to access or have access to. 01:22:37
And you engage in any sort of invasion of privacy? 01:22:42
Right. Or violate somebody's privacy rights? 01:22:45
That is not protected under this immunity because it is an individual. 01:22:48
Act of wrongful conduct by you outside the course and scope of your role. Yes, Council Member Gamma. 01:22:53
Would if we were accidentally sent something. And as soon as you realize, hey, I shouldn't have this. 01:22:59
What would be the best? 01:23:07
Practice. 01:23:09
Yeah, I would definitely, you know, if you come into possession of any information. 01:23:11
And somehow wrongfully attached to something and we get this in discovery all the time. 01:23:16
Our responsibility ethically as to what? 01:23:21
Only review it enough to figure out, hey, I shouldn't be seeing that. 01:23:23
Their legal litigation strategy? Take that. 01:23:26
Send it back to them, etcetera. You. 01:23:29
Either let somebody know, let HR know, Hey, I was given this information and my. 01:23:32
Council packet. 01:23:36
Right. Was attached to it. It doesn't look like I should have this. You're right, they may say destroy that. 01:23:37
Delete it, shred it, whatever. Or they may say we need that back. 01:23:42
Whatever that instruction is, if you comply with that upon learning. 01:23:46
Right, not studying it. 01:23:50
Blowing it up into a visual. 01:23:52
Anything like that, Upon learning of it, you get the instruction to do what you're supposed to do and you follow it. 01:23:54
I believe you would be just fine. It's inadvertent. 01:23:59
Unintentional. Not, you know, any sort of intent on your part to gain access to that or use it for any reason, or to violate 01:24:01
anyone's rights. 01:24:06
I think you'd be fine. 01:24:10
And I don't hear our city attorney objecting to that. So does that also include acts by individual? 01:24:13
Council members. 01:24:19
They that go against council direction. 01:24:22
On their own, that would be considered a violation of another individual's rights or. 01:24:25
Rights to privacy. 01:24:31
It it it includes any individual actions by a council member that violates somebody else's rights. 01:24:33
Some kind of tort claim? Some kind, whatever it is. 01:24:40
Right. Anything that we do? 01:24:43
As individuals, not as a collective. 01:24:45
Right. And I I'd argue that it is maybe some things you all decided to do that was a wrongful act that wouldn't qualify for the 01:24:48
immunity either. It'd be a conspiracy at that point, right? And then it wouldn't be protected either. Anything to add to that? Our 01:24:52
city attorney would be pretty good there. 01:24:56
And the main thing that I would add is that California law and similar federal laws protect legislators when they're acting in a 01:25:02
in a specifically legislative field. 01:25:06
So the discussions that you have on the day on the dais, acting in the capacity as a representative Council and and passing 01:25:11
ordinances and resolutions in that regard. 01:25:16
That is all pretty. 01:25:21
Protected under legislative immunity. 01:25:24
Once you start acting as an agent of the city individually, without council authorization and things of that nature. 01:25:26
That's where personal liability will attach. 01:25:34
Yeah, and and even if you prevail, what a nightmare and a headache those things are. 01:25:38
Not just from the PR standpoint, but just from your own piece of mind. Laying your head on your pillow at night without this 01:25:42
hanging over your head? Yes. 01:25:45
That suggest that perhaps there should be another caveat. 01:25:51
And the caveat being that. 01:25:54
If your. 01:25:56
Opining or doing something. 01:25:58
Relative to city business. 01:26:01
Right. I mean what I do at my work, what I do. 01:26:04
On my own personal time. 01:26:07
Is one thing but. 01:26:10
If it's related to city business and that's where. 01:26:12
You could. 01:26:16
Could you drag the city into liability situation like. 01:26:17
I don't want to. 01:26:22
Give any specifics, but you understand what I'm saying like yeah and if you're if you're commenting on city business. 01:26:22
Irresponsibly. 01:26:28
Doing an action to try and. 01:26:30
Sway something one way or another that. 01:26:32
I think that's where sounds very Machiavellian right there, right. Yeah, we're out there trying to influence behaviors or change 01:26:35
or support or whatever else. Yeah, there's there's potential for it and I'm sure Mr. Preciado that the plaintiffs bar will throw 01:26:41
whatever they want against the wall and see if it sticks and one of the ones that. 01:26:47
Typically gets thrown out is a 42US code 1983, which is a deprivation of civil rights under color of authority. So even if a 01:26:53
council member or a city agent was. 01:26:58
Not acting within the course and scope of his or her duties, the frequent argument or under some qualified immunity. The frequent 01:27:03
the frequent argument is that. 01:27:07
Some member of the public's rights were violated under color of authority and therefore the city is liable because, let's face it, 01:27:12
the city has deeper pockets. 01:27:16
Small cities doesn't matter, right? There's a JPA out there who will pay, and that's how they look at it. They know, they know the 01:27:21
structure of things, right? Good, good. Pivot over to a JPA, right? What if you're serving on other? 01:27:27
Boards on behalf of the city. 01:27:33
Right. Can you give me some idea of what those would be? I know the one Cal JPA. 01:27:36
Council Member Gamma. You the representative on Cal J PIA, that board. 01:27:41
What other ones would it be? 01:27:45
SCAG Very good. 01:27:47
Who? Who's representing us on that? 01:27:48
Yeah. 01:27:50
Both of you. 01:27:51
Alright, any others that we have? 01:27:52
Are those? 01:27:54
OK. 01:27:59
So, so you're out there. 01:28:02
This is an extension right of your role on this governance team. 01:28:04
And I think each of you would want from the other if there were things relevant to matters pending before the city that. 01:28:08
Everybody came back and discharged their duty and responsibility to keep the governance team informed. 01:28:14
Right. If if Cal JPI was changing their model for. 01:28:19
You know, calculating the experience modification factor, the xmod which determines your contributions every year to maintain your 01:28:23
membership there for general liability for EPL for whatever coverage is out there. 01:28:29
You'd want to know that. You'd want the rest of the governance team to know that so you can decide. 01:28:35
If it should go on an agenda. 01:28:40
Right. And and whatever process we're going through to make sure we get things on the agenda. 01:28:42
I like seeing the word agendas, but I hate that it keeps getting autocorrected in every other document you know and so. 01:28:47
That's that's an important part of it. So that we have a discussion, hey, should we look elsewhere? 01:28:53
Right. For this cover, should we go back to the commercial market? It's soft, right, whatever that is. And so that's the key here. 01:28:58
So that's important for you to keep each other informed. 01:29:02
Especially on things pertaining to the city and the best interest of the city. 01:29:06
But just wanted to give you 1 slide on some stuff here on the top one. 01:29:10
When you're on those boards, you really do us a great service. 01:29:13
And conducting the people's business. 01:29:17
If you are as prepared or just say well prepared there as you would be for any City Council meeting. 01:29:19
You know as as somebody again who ran those those Jpas for so long with my colleagues. 01:29:25
Was a wonderful experience to have that much of the public interest in mind. 01:29:31
And and protecting that almighty sacred tax dollar, right? 01:29:35
And it was always disheartening to see a board member sit down at those JPA meetings. 01:29:38
As back when we had binders mostly right and break the seal on that binder for the first time as they sit down. 01:29:43
To conduct the business of that JPA. 01:29:49
That's tough, right? Because there's so much information that staff went into with all that. So be prepared and be prepared to 01:29:52
analyze that data. 01:29:56
And needs to be analyzed so you can make informed decisions. 01:30:00
For the collective. 01:30:03
Any questions about that? Any disagreement there? 01:30:04
Is it a burden? You just show up and that's OK? 01:30:07
Second one, exercise board member voting rights and cast votes based on the best available information. 01:30:11
And the best interest of the people still think of those four pillars, right? And what that means? 01:30:16
Work through the city manager when seeking any information from that group. 01:30:21
Whether it's a pollution board, an air quality board, a county board of. 01:30:25
You know that were assigned to et cetera. 01:30:29
When there's things that are needed, I know you're the board member. 01:30:31
But still your your job. 01:30:35
Right overall, as a council member, said a vision. 01:30:38
Policies and procedures communicate and champion. 01:30:42
Higher City manager and work through them. 01:30:45
Your board member role there has limitations. 01:30:48
Right. Participate in reading the material. 01:30:51
If you want things from that board, information, some statistics that were cited, et cetera, because it somehow relates to what 01:30:53
we're doing here. 01:30:57
I wonder what it is we're doing here that needs that. Is that your council member governance team role stuff? 01:31:02
Or is it something related to a staff report that's relevant to something that's on the agenda? 01:31:08
If so, that needs to go to the city manager. 01:31:13
That goes to the city manager and the city manager will request that information from that board. 01:31:16
Whatever those things are. 01:31:21
Otherwise, you're getting into the weeds. 01:31:23
And you're starting to look like you're in the. 01:31:25
A place where you shouldn't be. 01:31:28
Any questions about that? That one isn't always clear to us as we see that going on. 01:31:30
And if you work for the city manager, it's the safest thing. 01:31:35
And as you discuss it with them. 01:31:38
You know it, it should be done in a way. 01:31:40
That, again, isn't creating individual action in a conversation that isn't by a sitting governance team. 01:31:42
So we may want to consider how we bring that up, where we bring that up, and if you're not sure. 01:31:49
Ask your city attorney. 01:31:54
Ask your city attorney what would be the best way. 01:31:56
If I believe I need this information. 01:31:58
From this JPA. 01:32:00
That manages our XY and Z. 01:32:02
You know and council. 01:32:05
Member Hernandez is on that board, and I think they could provide us with this data. 01:32:07
Should I just ask the city manager to get that Kevin, or should I, you know, figure that one out through? 01:32:12
The proper channels so that we don't start engaging in business that we shouldn't be engaged in. 01:32:17
As a long one, I know, I apologize. 01:32:22
Force. 01:32:25
Dude. 01:32:28
There's the whole. 01:32:29
Purposely. 01:32:30
Conducting business that would be left to. 01:32:31
Staff. 01:32:34
Yeah. 01:32:35
But it's cold. 01:32:36
Elected officials. 01:32:37
To do so. 01:32:39
Figure out. 01:32:41
When you're being appropriate as to how you're voting on something versus. 01:32:42
Whatever. 01:32:46
I could not have said it better. 01:32:47
It is very untidy. 01:32:49
There's nothing tidy about it, even though you know your role there and your role here. 01:32:51
Where do I go with that? So my this is. 01:32:55
Sorry, I'm on a bit of a soapbox here. 10 seconds. Indulge me, please. 01:32:58
My preference is that these Jpas. 01:33:01
If their governing documents allow it. 01:33:04
Have employees of the city on the boards rather than. 01:33:06
Elected people on the boards. 01:33:09
And I've worked with both. 01:33:12
And it just seems easier and much tidier when it is a. 01:33:13
Umm. 01:33:17
Assistant city manager. 01:33:18
Or a risk manager or someone like that on that board. 01:33:20
Rather than an elected person, but it works. It's worked for years. 01:33:23
And the governing documents of those Jpas dictate that. 01:33:27
So this I. 01:33:31
Served on a JPA for a very long time. 01:33:32
A public agency? 01:33:35
And there were no elected officials on that board. And so I'm wondering why then does the California JPIA? 01:33:36
Insist on having elected officials on the board and I know it's been a long time practice because I forget the ladies name, but 01:33:44
she's been on the executive committee for 30 years. 01:33:49
That's a long time. That's a long time she's from. 01:33:55
I forget her name. She's been an elected person for 30 years and she's been on the executive committee for probably 20 years. 01:33:58
There's something impressive and sick all at the same time there with that, but no. But my experience had always been like, you 01:34:04
know, the elected officials were. 01:34:08
We would report to the board, excuse me. 01:34:13
We would report. 01:34:16
I'm Risk Manager, so I would report, hey, we have this settlement that's above our authority level. 01:34:18
And we would go to the Board of Directors for direction. 01:34:24
But yeah, I just find it very odd that you're. I agree with you that. 01:34:28
All these elected officials on the. 01:34:32
Yeah, they're they're not alone though. Council member game. A lot of pools are like that a lot. We pool JPA. We use them 01:34:34
interchangeably, right? 01:34:38
And so I I don't know why some are, but they and they date way back. You're right, they're governance documents from the outset. 01:34:42
And it'll be up to them to change them if it seems like it makes sense. But. 01:34:48
I think they're like I said, they're one of the. 01:34:52
Finest operating pools and sustainable pools in California. Maybe the country. 01:34:55
Cal JPA. It's a strong pool. 01:35:00
You know the goal one day is that every poll will operate in a way that. 01:35:02
Your contributions overtime. 01:35:05
Are offset by all the risk management and loss prevention. 01:35:07
And those dollars that sit there. 01:35:10
Right. Invested in in life and other things that they have to be because they're public dollars. 01:35:12
They get handled in such a way that the return on that money. 01:35:17
Will cover your contributions for the next year and the next year after that, right? And it keeps kind of self fulfilling. 01:35:20
And the only disasters when catastrophic events happen that create liability that that's not sustainable, but there's there's a 01:35:26
lot of good reasons out there for it. But. 01:35:30
I prefer the tidier way of non elected people, but. 01:35:35
That doesn't mean it's the wrong way to have elected people. I just happen to have a preference there. 01:35:38
So continuing on. So the last thing I already covered, keep the council apprised of your work on whatever board you're on, right? 01:35:43
That's important. We all want to be included so that we're not caught off guard one day. We have to make a big decision. 01:35:49
That could have been, we could have been dealing with or processing for a year or two. 01:35:54
And we're just hearing about it at the crisis moment. 01:35:58
So here are some common pitfalls right that we'll just talk about in general. 01:36:01
And I do want your input on these. 01:36:04
So just there's there's four of them that I selected based on conversations with all of you. 01:36:06
Social media posts, for example, right? We do know in the law, for example. 01:36:11
That social media posts can create liability for cities. 01:36:16
Social media posts can trigger policy offenses by employees. 01:36:21
If they can, reasonably. 01:36:26
You know. 01:36:28
Be determined to be directed at coworkers like a firefighter who has said. 01:36:30
Yeah, it's just my my my opinion. 01:36:34
Right, My constitutionally protected First Amendment right here to say. 01:36:37
I don't think women should be in public safety, especially fire. 01:36:40
If I need one of them to carry out my 250 pound body from a burning building. 01:36:44
You know, how are they going to do that? And so forth and so on. Just exercising rights well. 01:36:48
You know, courts can reasonably determine that those were directed at their female firefighters in the departments. 01:36:52
Right And and hold them accountable for that and allow this uphold the cities decision. 01:36:57
To reprimand them, to demote them, or whatever else happened in those cases. 01:37:02
So likewise. 01:37:06
Sitting council members, elected council members. 01:37:08
Whether appointed or elected. 01:37:12
Making statements on social media. 01:37:14
To piggyback onto something, I think, council member Gamma said. Can they create liability for the city? 01:37:16
And the answer is. 01:37:22
Affirmative from our city attorney. 01:37:23
They can. 01:37:25
So. 01:37:26
You're like the whole world's absolutely entitled to have social media presence. 01:37:27
And a matter of fact, it seems odd. 01:37:33
In this world so driven by social media that an elected person wouldn't have a social media presence. 01:37:35
Except for the one or two who got hacked once or twice and was attributed some horrible things and decided I'm off completely now, 01:37:41
right? 01:37:44
And other things happen like. 01:37:47
A national presence? 01:37:50
Umm. 01:37:52
Very well known and very accomplished influentially. 01:37:53
Congresswoman from New York, Alexandria Ocasio Cortez. 01:37:57
Who had a Twitter account created? 01:38:01
You know that looks like her name. It has her picture on it. 01:38:03
And it just says something like the real AOC or something like that. 01:38:06
And she and the person makes statements as if it's her. 01:38:09
Right. 01:38:12
And Twitter says it's OK. 01:38:14
I don't know if pre Elon Musk Twitter would have said it's OK, but this one does. 01:38:16
And so there's all those challenges like that. 01:38:21
But just be aware. 01:38:24
No one's going to look at that ever and say ohh, they must be saying that as a private citizen. 01:38:26
That is not a positive assumption that is going to be made about you by 9 out of 10 members of the public. 01:38:32
Business holders, stakeholders in the city, et cetera. 01:38:37
They're going to assume you meant it in the worst way possible, and for your own personal reasons. 01:38:40
So be careful with any social media post. 01:38:46
And then another part of that. 01:38:48
Is um. 01:38:50
You. 01:38:51
Umm. 01:38:53
Putting out into the world. 01:38:54
Right, positive things that you're engaged in. 01:38:56
You know, whether it's a beach cleanup some of us talked about. 01:38:59
Other events bringing unity to the city and being inclusive events. 01:39:03
You put those out there as invites. 01:39:07
Somebody shows up because the mayor posted he was going to be there. 01:39:10
And there was going to be some great music and my favorite churros. 01:39:14
And so I show up. 01:39:17
And then I get injured. 01:39:18
Right at it. 01:39:20
And it looks to me like it was a city event. That's the only reason I came. 01:39:21
Was the mayor posted on it that he was going? 01:39:25
And I wanted to be there too. 01:39:27
And then I slip on some sand. I crack a hip. 01:39:29
Little bit of a brain injury. 01:39:33
Autoimmune encephalitis kicks in. 01:39:35
I'm just thinking of a real case and so forth, right? And so. 01:39:37
It happens, right? So any any questions about that? Because those boundaries are so untidy to use that phrase again. 01:39:41
About what's OK to put out there, please. 01:39:49
I'm not. 01:39:54
Talking about public statements or social media, but I am. 01:39:55
Wondering. 01:39:59
About I'm walking through the park. 01:40:00
And I see a risk. 01:40:03
Tomorrow it's got my hat on. 01:40:05
And our report it through Go Gov. 01:40:07
And it doesn't get corrected. 01:40:12
And I think what I'm hearing you say is OK, well then you better talk about it on the Dyess or get an agendas or or something. 01:40:14
Or do I? 01:40:21
Follow up again, Hey, Mr. City Manager, remember. 01:40:23
Pointing this out. Still there, still a risk. 01:40:26
Is. I guess I would ask this question, Council member. 01:40:30
In those four areas of. 01:40:34
Vision. 01:40:36
Policies and procedures. 01:40:37
Championing. Communicating. 01:40:39
And hiring and retaining the city manager and executive leader to. 01:40:41
Implement that vision. 01:40:46
Right. 01:40:48
Does it include anywhere? 01:40:49
In those responsibilities. 01:40:50
You. 01:40:52
Identifying. 01:40:53
Umm. 01:40:55
Risks. 01:40:55
Trip and fall risk It does not. 01:40:57
But I'm a resident and I am accident prone myself and um. 01:41:00
So again, you know. 01:41:05
We have the Go Gov. 01:41:08
Yeah, which is available to all residents. 01:41:10
And um. 01:41:13
But. 01:41:15
This particular resident is a City Council person. 01:41:16
And. 01:41:20
Do I? 01:41:21
Make my request through the go Gov and then just wash my hands of it and say Lavie. 01:41:22
I don't know. 01:41:29
I I guess I'm pushing back on the idea that. 01:41:31
You have to. 01:41:33
Make any notice of it I mean. 01:41:34
I think we would want, it's hard to, it's hard to have a public discussion on this particular subject. The whole point of the 01:41:38
Gogov. 01:41:41
Is for residents to report issues. Graffiti, for example. Graffiti, yes. 01:41:45
You see graffiti? Public. It's on public property. Boom. 01:41:50
The city is aware they got a GPS pinpoint. 01:41:54
Could go take care of it. 01:41:57
So it's a really good service. Ohh, it sounds terrific. 01:41:59
If I may, Council Member Gamma, I think the distinction is is that. 01:42:02
As a resident of the city and like all residents of the city, a council member who came across us trip and fall injury or a trip 01:42:07
and fall liability, issue graffiti or a fallen tree, Any number of those things. 01:42:13
Can report to Gogov and can probably send an e-mail to the city manager via that via the the city's website. 01:42:19
The difference, and one of the things that was warned about earlier, is that taking any steps beyond that you are not acting or 01:42:27
that council member would not be acting within the scope and capacity of a normal citizen. 01:42:33
Suddenly, the City Council member hat goes on. 01:42:40
Suddenly we're providing direction. 01:42:42
Or. 01:42:45
Hinting at official action outside of a regularly agendized meeting. 01:42:45
It's not. 01:42:50
Within. 01:42:51
The scope of where councils are supposed to operate at that level, it's more day-to-day operations. 01:42:53
Personnel management between city manager directors, it gets too far into the weeds. 01:42:59
That being said. 01:43:06
Councils certainly capable of taking note of. 01:43:09
Certain issues within the city. 01:43:13
And there are. 01:43:15
Annual, if not more frequent evaluations of city executive performance. 01:43:16
That might be inappropriate time to evaluate. 01:43:22
We may have some issues with certain performance objectives. 01:43:26
And we need to discuss that, but as far as lobbying or going beyond go, go for a particular outcome. 01:43:29
That's not. 01:43:36
A tool available to the average resident. 01:43:38
Just wanted one other thing then. 01:43:42
And hypotheticals management are abound. So OK, so I do a go Gov. 01:43:45
The significant tripping hazard. 01:43:52
I did one go, go, go. I did another go, go, but now I'm just going to wash my hands of it and I'll deal with it when we come back 01:43:55
from our month long recess and then somebody suffers A catastrophic injury. 01:44:00
And there's a lawsuit. Like I said, brain injury, like a catastrophic injury. We know where that's going to go. 01:44:07
Yeah, right now. 01:44:11
With the JPA. 01:44:15
Want me to come forward and say, hey, by the way, I reported this twice or would you want me and I could tell you me myself? 01:44:17
I would make that information available to the JPA because I would think eventually it's going to come out. 01:44:26
But. 01:44:32
Do you understand what I'm saying? It's like. 01:44:32
Yeah, I understand what you're saying. 01:44:34
For me, it's lacking in some foundational premise, though I think I said our city attorney was pointing that out that. 01:44:36
As a citizen, if you want to identify a tripping hazard that you discovered significant or insignificant, but a tripping hazard, 01:44:42
period. 01:44:46
That using Gogov or an e-mail or anything of the kind. 01:44:51
I think you can do that as any I think you should think could, right. Any citizen can. 01:44:55
But when you start to persist on those things. 01:45:00
It really looks like you're giving an order. 01:45:03
Right of things here, and we can go down the parade of horribles for any potential liability. 01:45:06
Right. That could happen here within the jurisdiction of the city of Port Winema. 01:45:12
Does that mean that all of you should have your risk manager head on looking for things and? 01:45:16
And emailing and go giving them and all the rest, right? 01:45:22
That's not the typical scope of what the people elected you to do. 01:45:26
As far as the business goes? 01:45:30
I can't think of a city. 01:45:33
I can't think of a single city. 01:45:35
That isn't doing its level best to eliminate. 01:45:37
Right within the resources they have. 01:45:41
Any potential liability created as a result of any. 01:45:44
Risk management issue, whether it's tripping hazards, whether it's, you know, we all know that how this street was designed was 01:45:48
pretty sketchy and so forth and so on. 01:45:54
You know, there's only so much they can do and so. 01:45:59
Nowhere in my. 01:46:02
Understanding. 01:46:04
And I. 01:46:06
It's going to be a little bit. 01:46:07
Self aggrandizing maybe, but I've worked with a lot of councils. 01:46:09
And I do consider myself a subject matter expert on the subject of the role of city councils. 01:46:13
And and I just have never seen where that role. 01:46:18
Of being the default risk manager because you're a subject matter expert, no question for the port, I think. 01:46:22
And that that is your responsibility to do that. 01:46:27
If you do it as a citizen, great. 01:46:30
But when you keep doing it, it looks like you're 1 member of a governance team given direction to the city. 01:46:33
Could something happen? Yes. 01:46:38
Right, that's true of just about any observations you make in those things. That tree looks sketchy. 01:46:40
Right, that sundial. 01:46:44
Could be this, that or the other. 01:46:46
So I I'm just rambling now. I just want to say that I just don't see. 01:46:48
Where that would fall into your responsibility. And so the question then of Cal JPIA. 01:46:52
Umm. 01:46:58
They would not want any governance team leader. 01:46:59
Putting their own public entity on notice. 01:47:03
Of potential liability situations unnecessarily. 01:47:08
OK, so you're going to have to unpack that one. 01:47:12
Umm. 01:47:16
I can't think of necessarily, I mean, but but you do agree that? 01:47:17
Any and all residents are encouraged to use Gogov. Ohh absolutely sounds like a great tool. 01:47:23
Now if I take what you just said to heart like 100% sounds like you're saying to me, look, you're a City Council person, you 01:47:28
probably shouldn't be putting the city on notice about risk. 01:47:32
No, what I'm really saying is you should not be. 01:47:37
Creating liability for the city. 01:47:40
I didn't create the tripping hazard, I'm just reporting it. 01:47:43
And there's the liability reporting it. 01:47:46
It has to do with certain provisions relating to notice that are approvable element of premises liability for a public entity. The 01:47:50
rules against public entity or the rules relating to public entities are very different. 01:47:57
Than let's say a private citizens walkway approach to their house or something like that. Grocery store or a grocery store or 01:48:05
something. 01:48:09
And. 01:48:13
Because those rules are different. 01:48:14
And I can understand the concern, the general concern of the public. 01:48:18
The problem lies in that. 01:48:21
And not meaning to speak for the JPIA, but I can. I can put this to the city attorney, for example. 01:48:25
My responsibility. 01:48:31
Is to the corporate entity. 01:48:33
It is not to this Council, it is not to any individual Council member. 01:48:35
It is not to the city manager, it is not to any member of this staff. 01:48:39
My client. 01:48:44
Is the city and I'm obligated to protect my client. 01:48:46
If providing that notice harms my client's interest. 01:48:51
I do not want it. 01:48:56
Now do we want last thing on that is. 01:48:59
Do we want to be made aware of those things through established processes that our city manager? 01:49:02
Ushers in for us because you say in your vision, creating through your strategic planning, we want a safe city. We want these 01:49:09
Gopher holes removed from our field so that kids aren't busting an ankle. 01:49:14
You know, yeah. And then it goes back to performance management of the city manager. 01:49:19
Are we creating safe parks? 01:49:23
Are our sidewalks safer this year than they were last year? I I. 01:49:25
I'm having a hard time with what our city attorney just said, so let me try it this way. 01:49:29
I come in to meet with you, the city manager said. Hey, you know, the Gopher holes are crazy out there. 01:49:34
Just letting you making you aware here, here's a photograph. 01:49:40
And then just leave it at that. 01:49:44
No. 01:49:45
I just feel like I've been told that I've just created liability for the city because I've made the city manager aware of Gopher 01:49:47
holes in a park where kids play. 01:49:51
That is the whole premise of. 01:49:56
Premise liability. 01:49:58
Is duty to inform awareness dangerous condition? Should they have known? Would they have known? Right. I get that. I get all that. 01:49:59
But. 01:50:06
I. 01:50:07
I. 01:50:08
Sounds like I'm being told to ignore it and don't report it. No, that's not what you're being told. What we're being told is let's 01:50:09
use the channel of the governance team. 01:50:13
And let's let's set the direction, council member that says. 01:50:17
Hey, as a governance team, as we do our strategic planning maybe sometime in the fall with the facilitator. 01:50:21
Is one of our priorities for this city over the next year and a half, three years and certainly by 10 years. 01:50:26
To rid ourselves and then have a regular schedule. 01:50:31
Of preventative maintenance. 01:50:34
And getting on top of deferred maintenance 10 years from now, yes, including dangerous conditions. 01:50:37
By. 01:50:43
Inspection of our employees of these locations. 01:50:43
That is where we handle it. We're not ignoring it. No one's ignoring it. 01:50:47
Nobody on this governance team and nobody working for this city wakes up and says. 01:50:51
Ohh, who cares about tripping hazards, right? Or who cares about Gopher holes? 01:50:55
We just want to go through the process that makes sense without creating anything unnecessarily. 01:50:58
So you're. 01:51:05
But if we had it on. 01:51:07
An agenda? 01:51:08
To speak from here as a council. 01:51:11
You know that that in itself is doing the same thing. When we're speaking generally, we're not saying over on Maple Street there's 01:51:14
a 5 inch differential in the sidewalk because of that. 01:51:18
Eucalyptus tree. 01:51:23
And we're not gonna talk about individual. 01:51:24
You know, hazards, we're gonna say in general. 01:51:26
How are we doing on that schedule? 01:51:28
For grinding down the sidewalks that are uneven, right? Well, we identified 14 different ones and we're working on this now, 01:51:30
whatever that would be, right? And we would be covering it that way without speaking to specific issues along those lines. 01:51:37
You've had your hand up along time going back to social media posts, so. 01:51:45
There's a mini beach festival going on. 01:51:49
Can I promote the Miami Beach Festival through my social media and inviting people? Hey, come to the Wanami Beach Festival. It's a 01:51:52
city sponsored event. 01:51:55
Is it a city sponsored event? 01:51:59
Yeah, if it's official city sponsored event. 01:52:01
Then I you know with that, I assume we took all the steps necessary to ensure that. 01:52:04
Whether it's Cal, JPI or somebody else is aware and you know, we, you know, we're covered for those things, then yeah, by all 01:52:08
means, I think that's fine if it's an official city sponsored event. 01:52:13
The only time it gets a little dicey. 01:52:17
Is if it's something you really love and is happening. 01:52:19
And you're promoting it as well through the same medium and so forth. 01:52:22
And then that you used to promote the city events, right? So for me. 01:52:26
This is just me, Mr. Mayor. 01:52:31
I like having a. 01:52:33
Mayor Bobby Martinez's social media presence. 01:52:35
And then a Bobby Martinez social presence, right social media presence for these different things and only on this one do you 01:52:39
promote city specific city sponsored events, official ones? 01:52:43
And on this one you know events that you enjoy and appreciate and maybe even because I I am still a lawyer at heart. 01:52:48
Still license, I just don't and represent individual clients. 01:52:56
I might even want a little. 01:53:00
Disclaimer on there. 01:53:01
Right at the beginning of that one. Small letters, but a disclaimer nonetheless. 01:53:03
That shows this is you. 01:53:07
This is not official, I use this. 01:53:09
A mechanism, this medium, for promoting things that I enjoy. 01:53:12
And are not officially sponsored events of the City of Port Winding. 01:53:16
I've seen that done and it looks pretty nice that way. 01:53:20
And they're both good. 01:53:22
Yes. 01:53:25
Council member, I'm sorry, is your mic on? 01:53:33
Think you have social media page but I have one under my name. 01:53:36
Without my title. 01:53:40
And I generally put anything out there that's going on in the city that's on the city web page. 01:53:42
Things that I like that are not part of the city, that are other things that the community might like to go out to. So should I 01:53:49
not be doing that? That's one of the things that I picked up because I'm hearing a lot that our community is not hearing about 01:53:53
events. 01:53:57
So I'm trying to do my part. Ohh that's great form, but what shouldn't I be doing? 01:54:02
To the extent you are able. 01:54:07
My answer is the same to everybody who asked me that question, and that is. 01:54:09
Make sure that it is clear. 01:54:13
This is a Martha McQueen lejohn. 01:54:15
You know personal preference here and not a city sponsored event because you are a public figure as a council member. 01:54:18
Of the city. And so I like that. Cleaner, too different. 01:54:25
Social media context there, and by the way, that doesn't guarantee somebody's not gonna come back at us. 01:54:29
From the plaintiff sports still try and throw all this. 01:54:34
Fecal matter against the wall and see what sticks here. But it is cleaner and I do like it better that way. But that's just one 01:54:36
person's opinion. 01:54:40
Can you, let's just say you do have two separate Instagram accounts? 01:54:45
And can you still promote stuff through your personal because there's people that you'd be reaching through your personal that you 01:54:49
won't reach through your other account. 01:54:52
I think then you defeat the purpose of having the two separate ones. 01:54:56
OK. Yeah. 01:55:00
Because the One is the private, private Bobby Martinez, cool citizen of Port Wanami and Ventura County. 01:55:01
And the other one is the mayor. 01:55:07
And then that's just, that is just your advice it there isn't anything against having one Instagram account. 01:55:09
That is correct. That is Jerry Preciado squarely 100% advice. 01:55:14
Based on experience to to add a little bit more on that the the issue is is that. 01:55:19
You can create. 01:55:26
Public forums. 01:55:28
And limited public forums. 01:55:29
And the argument becomes that if you haven't maintained a private space, that's clearly an individual account. 01:55:30
Once you've created a public forum, you can no longer moderate it. 01:55:36
You can no longer engage engage in content discrimination. 01:55:39
You can no longer remove posts. 01:55:42
You lose pretty much. 01:55:45
All of your ability to control that. 01:55:46
So. 01:55:49
And and as we saw with former President Trump, if you block somebody on some of those accounts, you can be individually liable as 01:55:49
well. 01:55:53
You know, that's far more in depth than I appreciate that answer and I will remember that statement the next time I share this 01:55:59
information because that makes a lot of sense in that context. 01:56:03
And so have we created We. We can't say because we don't have all the facts. 01:56:08
But have we created this public forum under Bobby Martinez Instagram account? You're the mayor, you're promoting these things. 01:56:13
Other people comment and they do other things. 01:56:19
We we did have to be looked at on a case by case basis, right, But. 01:56:21
You know, we we just want to be clear and and again. 01:56:25
We speak with them. 01:56:27
Mindset and a filter and a paradigm of a parade of horribles, right? And try to anticipate and predict things that can happen to 01:56:30
give you the best advice to keep you safe. 01:56:34
This is all about. 01:56:39
Helping 5. 01:56:41
Civic minded. 01:56:42
Well intended. 01:56:45
Loving Port Winema citizens who are also government leaders. 01:56:46
Be as safe as you can be. 01:56:50
And create a safer and safe. 01:56:52
Port Manimi as well in that context. 01:56:56
So that's where this is all coming from, the public statements, I think that one self-explanatory, right? 01:56:59
Anything you say you you may say things like off the record, I'm not speaking as mayor. 01:57:04
But does any of that really counts? No. 01:57:10
No, and I think you've probably all been misquoted, misunderstood, or or or misstated. 01:57:13
Et cetera. And so it happened, so just be aware. 01:57:18
Public statements. 01:57:21
Are always going to have your council member hat on. I know there's no specific law that says that I'm covering Kevin right now 01:57:23
for the moment, right? 01:57:26
But there's enough practice out there that that's the safest harbor I can give you. 01:57:31
Don't do it or don't say it thinking you can say it as a private citizen. 01:57:35
When you are a council member, when you are the mayor, Pro Tem, et cetera. Any questions about that? 01:57:39
So a couple others. I know we covered this in the very beginning, but even the appearance of impropriety, what does it look like? 01:57:46
There's my example, which was very private. 01:57:50
And Original Joe's in downtown San Jose. 01:57:54
But then there's others. 01:57:56
Where, you know, we're pretty small community where people know you. 01:57:58
Long before you were a member of council, you were out there leading cleanups. You were out there. 01:58:03
Doing a a variety of things. 01:58:08
And so you find yourself at the Marina not far from here. 01:58:09
And there is a developer who has an incredible boat. Maybe you've known them for a long time, long before you were a volunteer and 01:58:13
a council member. 01:58:16
And they take you on their boat. Everybody sees you getting on there's. 01:58:21
You know the Marina website posting pictures of recent events and this developer who happens to be looking for a variance from our 01:58:24
Planning Commission. 01:58:28
Is taking you fishing for the day. 01:58:32
For whatever that thing is. But Jerry, I've been doing this for 25 years. 01:58:35
I've been going on his annual weekend fishing trip for 25 years. You mean I gotta stop? 01:58:39
That's my answer. 01:58:43
Avoiding the appearance of impropriety. 01:58:45
You will never regret. You won't. 01:58:48
Umm. 01:58:51
Having somebody have a field day. 01:58:52
Because this person got their variance. 01:58:54
And now they're going to be able to do XY or Z. 01:58:57
And now they're just all upset. And then this picture of you. 01:59:00
On this boat. 01:59:03
With this fish. 01:59:05
Right. And A and a course in the other hand. 01:59:06
Problematic. Problematic. Do you remember that famous boat called Monkey Business? 01:59:09
All too well. 01:59:15
If you're old enough, you remember that one, right? So just avoid that and then. 01:59:16
Conversations with city employees about work. One of you shared with me them a recent. 01:59:22
Experience where you understood. 01:59:28
That employees were told. 01:59:31
They shouldn't engage with you. 01:59:33
Right. 01:59:35
And they shouldn't engage in dialogue or conversation with you. Kind of like avoid you. 01:59:36
Which? 01:59:41
I I don't think it's the. 01:59:42
The best strategy in the world. I understand why somebody might give that. 01:59:44
But I don't think it's the best strategy in the world. And and we do want to keep you safe, but not to the point where all of a 01:59:49
sudden you feel like persona non grata come into the city, right? 01:59:53
We do want you to be able to connect with the employees, but mostly as a leader. 01:59:58
Thank them. 02:00:02
Be grateful for them. Express your appreciation for all they're doing for the citizens. 02:00:04
Stakeholders and businesses of this great city. 02:00:09
That's something you can do. 02:00:11
Right, and and I encourage you to do so, Catch them doing good. 02:00:13
Right. Don't feel the need to be home monitors of the employees when you're here at the city because you are the ultimate bosses 02:00:19
and you are. 02:00:22
Because their ultimate boss. 02:00:26
Is it reports to you? 02:00:29
Right. So that part is OK. 02:00:31
If if questions come up about and I have a an employee I'm working with in another city. 02:00:34
In Southern Cal, who has tremendous access? 02:00:40
To the Council. 02:00:43
And talks to two council members on a regular basis. 02:00:45
And they're not related. They're not dating. Nothing like that. 02:00:48
They just know that she is a get it done gal. I've always wanted to be a get it done guy. 02:00:51
Because then people can really count on you, you know? But she's a get it done gal and so. 02:00:57
Going around her boss. She's a manager. The boss is a director. 02:01:02
They say hey, they'll call her. They'll text her and say hey. 02:01:06
This island over on such and such city. 02:01:09
Are such and such part of the the city? 02:01:12
And there's this And boom. 02:01:14
Within 48 hours, it's done. 02:01:15
It's done. 02:01:17
And so now her boss gives her direction and whatnot. 02:01:19
And that very little. 02:01:22
Impact on her. 02:01:24
If the two council members. 02:01:25
Aren't in agreement with what the director is saying or wants. 02:01:28
It started off as just conversations about, hey, what's your favorite part of the job? 02:01:32
I like the stuff that's forward facing to the residents that that's how it started, right? 02:01:37
And that's fine, but it just went too far. 02:01:42
And now this relationship I'm trying to undo because. 02:01:44
The director is ready to separate her for insubordination and for a number of other things. 02:01:47
And how's that going to fly when the city manager knows that she's a favorite of two council members, right? 02:01:53
All kinds of untidy things happen when we go too far in our conversations. 02:01:59
You know, including one that was started like this. 02:02:03
We'll say that Bobby is the employee, right? And I'm the council member. 02:02:07
Hey, Bobby. 02:02:10
Maple Street Park. 02:02:11
The way that those garbage cans are being emptied on a more regular basis now. 02:02:13
Fantastic. 02:02:18
And that's how it starts, just like that. So there's one way to show appreciation, which is, hey, thanks for all you're doing, but 02:02:21
then you get down into the weeds too much with details like that, and all of a sudden it turns into this dysfunctional 02:02:24
relationship. 02:02:28
An unhealthy relationship that could be creating all kinds of problems. 02:02:33
For managing that city on a day-to-day basis, so be careful. 02:02:36
That's the potential pitfall right now. I have no comment to add to that. If somehow one of you is married to an employee of the 02:02:39
city, that is what it is and you do your very best as an elected person myself. 02:02:46
Being married to somebody in a unit, I was on a school board. 02:02:52
And my wife was heavily involved with a. 02:02:56
A. 02:02:58
Parent group for gifted students. 02:03:00
And wanted to make sure that we were going to fund certain things. 02:03:03
We kept it separate, right? I'm looking at our mayor Pro Tem. We kept it separate. She didn't bother me too much about things and. 02:03:07
I kept that firewall up pretty good to not let her know I'm privileged information. Things like that. Because you have to. We 02:03:13
trusted you to do that. All of you. 02:03:17
And to my knowledge, you're doing a good job. You really are on so many things, we just have to Polish up a few. So thanks, thanks 02:03:21
for keeping that balance. 02:03:25
And thanks for doing all that. It's not easy. It's not easy. I'll grant that. Especially for somebody who's not a very good secret 02:03:30
keeper like me. 02:03:33
And had good news and wanted to share it but I couldn't Right kind of thing. 02:03:37
So, well done. I'm balancing all that and those conversations. 02:03:40
Stay out of those as much the extent possible with all of it. 02:03:44
So all I wanted to say here on this one, I'm looking at how that's two different colors. 02:03:47
This that you have created. 02:03:52
It's as good a document as I've seen like it. 02:03:57
And so you're all familiar with this? 02:04:01
That I'm holding right here. It was signed by. 02:04:04
All of you, I believe, except. 02:04:08
Martha. 02:04:12
Sorry, council member McQueen Lejohn. Maybe it was just too much for me, Martha. 02:04:13
Were you all here last November? 02:04:21
I believe it was. 02:04:23
Yeah. 02:04:24
Ohh. Rollins was here comma Hernandez Perez Martinez, Yeah. 02:04:25
So the amended parts. 02:04:29
Last September. 02:04:32
I was voted on and on November 9. 02:04:34
And it shows all of you as. 02:04:37
Unanimous vote including Rollins. 02:04:38
Right when this was done. 02:04:41
According to the good records of our city clerk, which is why we have those. 02:04:42
Do all. 02:04:46
Believe in this document and what it's intended for. 02:04:48
It is a good document. 02:04:54
And and knowing that you all voted for in the affirmative, with the one exception. 02:04:56
But I'm comfortable in my interview. 02:05:00
With the Council member McQueen Lejohn, that she is absolutely committed to this. 02:05:02
Then I applaud you. 02:05:07
Because. 02:05:08
The challenge is once we pass it. 02:05:09
Is it going to modify our behavior? And I do see that I'm out of time. 02:05:12
And so here's what I want to say to you. There are measures in here. 02:05:15
For structure driving behavior. 02:05:20
There are civility aspects in here. There are professionalism aspects. There are nicely delineated statements in this 34 page 02:05:23
document. 02:05:27
That reminds you of how, what, when, right, and where we do things. 02:05:32
And the expected behavioral norms for professionalism. 02:05:37
For courtesy and civility. 02:05:40
And I applaud you for that. There are many councils that will refuse to pass a document like this because they don't want to be 02:05:43
bound by it. 02:05:46
And then others will change and and we'll try it again. We'll get some traction. It won't happen. 02:05:50
But this is only a piece of paper. 02:05:54
If we're not adhering to it. 02:05:57
And so structure drives behavior. 02:05:59
And my last thought. 02:06:02
When it comes right down to it. 02:06:05
In the world of checks and balances. 02:06:07
This one you have to check each other. 02:06:09
Right. I understand how uncomfortable it is because I've been present for a lot of these. 02:06:13
When? 02:06:18
A motion is made. 02:06:19
For a discussion on Dada Dada. 02:06:22
And it's about something related to the censure of a member of the governance team. 02:06:25
And it can get really challenging, I get that. 02:06:30
But those typically don't come up just Willy nilly or randomly or pulled out of the sky. 02:06:33
If somebody said something, did something, behaved in a certain way and you feel like that's not right. 02:06:39
And it's not in compliance with our own policy and procedures for this council. 02:06:45
It is OK to say hey that is not OK and if it's a pattern like OK. 02:06:49
Clearly they're not getting the message. 02:06:54
You know, we do need to have on the agenda. 02:06:56
You know, a a discussion about and of course our city attorney would. 02:06:58
Would ensure that we are crossing all our T's and dotting all our eyes for that agenda item to ensure we can discuss it. That 02:07:02
doesn't follow that there will be adequate evidence. 02:07:07
For the rest of you to say hey. 02:07:12
This does warrants. 02:07:14
Right demotion from Mayor Pro Tem. 02:07:16
This does warrant censure. This does warrant. It may not be there based on the facts that are presented. 02:07:18
But it might. 02:07:24
And if not you, then who? Who's supposed to govern you in that way? 02:07:26
So on the one hand, I say to you. 02:07:30
It is uncomfortable in those moments. 02:07:35
But you are not just judge discharging your duties and responsibilities. 02:07:38
A reference was made by our city attorney to basically a fiduciary duty, right? 02:07:42
You are not conducting the people's business if you are not holding each other accountable. 02:07:47
To this part of what your role is as a governance team. 02:07:52
So it's like I don't want to do that. Now I'm not saying you have to do it. That's the only way to solve it. 02:07:56
It could be an individual dialogue with the person by our mayor or some other situation. 02:08:00
Short of that, some informal resolution to it. 02:08:06
A commitment to cease and desist, that kind of thing. 02:08:09
But when it happens, it is just a process that we go through and that we're structured for and that you all agreed to. 02:08:13
Right. And so we should do it. 02:08:19
If it's needed. 02:08:21
And if it's not needed, then we won't do it. 02:08:22
If it's brought up and not seconded, it won't happen. 02:08:25
But if it's happening and in your heart you know what's happening, you need to support it. 02:08:28
At least through its due process components. 02:08:32
And then see what happens. 02:08:35
You can't just always avoid it and expect it to change. 02:08:37
You just cannot right as part of that. 02:08:40
Well, I started off with this. 02:08:43
Individually. 02:08:45
I appreciated meeting each one of you. 02:08:46
I don't believe with the talent level and experience that you bring to the table that there is a weak link on this City Council. 02:08:49
I believe that you have what it takes to be the best version of a governance team for the city of Port Wanami to achieve what it 02:08:54
can achieve. 02:08:59
If you all get into alignment with all of this. 02:09:03
And avoid things. 02:09:06
Like those adverse impact tones? 02:09:08
Avoid thing like making. 02:09:10
Statements personal. 02:09:13
Right. And avoid anything. 02:09:15
That has any appearance that you are about your business and not the city's business. 02:09:17
And sometimes those can be. 02:09:22
Very muddy for those of us watching you work. 02:09:25
So I share with you that if you stay in your role, setting a vision. 02:09:28
Passing policies and procedures, championing, communicating, ensuring people know what we're trying to accomplish, and then hiring 02:09:33
a good city manager to be the boots on the ground to get it done. 02:09:38
And move that needle of achievement. 02:09:43
You were going to do well by the city. 02:09:44
You're gonna achieve much, and we're all going to applaud you for it. 02:09:46
The disharmony that has happened in the past does not have to reflect our future. 02:09:49
You will get as much credit or more. 02:09:54
For creating more harmony going forward than the disharmony we've experienced in the past. And you'll deserve every ounce of that 02:09:56
credit. 02:10:00
Thank you so much for making time for me today. 02:10:04
And just as a sneak preview, in July we'll be talking more about. 02:10:06
Communication. 02:10:11
And conflict resolution, how we deal with it, how we manage it, because conflict is going to happen. We all know that, right? That 02:10:12
should be the bumper sticker. Conflict happens not. Other things happen. Right. So thanks, everybody. I appreciate your time and 02:10:18
your attentiveness. I mean that to all five of you. Thank you. Yes, thank you, Mr. Preciado. 02:10:24
Guess we're we're done with our meeting. The next regular meeting is scheduled for Monday, July 3rd at 4:00 PM. 02:10:33
I'd like to adjourn the meeting. The time is now 5:08 PM. 02:10:39
scroll up